American Society of Karate - Who are they?

[WhiteBeltJones]

Anybody know about these guys? http://www.askkarate.com/ My sister just started karate lessons through her college, and I asked what style she was studying (nosy older brother), and this is what she told me. I couldn't really find any concrete information on what they're all about.

They do mention some connection to Bill "Superfoot" Wallace.

Anybody know about the history/lineage/techniques of this system?

[rgoad]

You could just ASK them. (I apologize for that).

[Gene Williams]

Looks like garbage to me.

[shoshinkan]

Thats the spirit Gene, say it how it is eh!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


It looks like standard McDojo Modern Sport Points Fighting system, i wont label it karate.........................

[WhiteBeltJones]

Looks like garbage to me.



It looks like standard McDojo Modern Sport Points Fighting system, i wont label it karate.........................

So...nobody with any actual facts on the style/school? I agree that the presentation is not impressive, but I was hoping somebody 'round here had actual knowledge of what they're about.

Bueller? Bueller? :cool:

[Yang Wei Xin]

dont have any more info, and they dont' give you much to go off of on the site....


I didn't know that "Bill Superfoot Wallace" was the name of a system, i thought it was the name of a competitor.

[Musubi Dojo]

Had a hard time finding anthing about lineage or style, just this...

http://askkarate.cmasdirect.com/site/view/AboutKarate.pml

Cheers
c

[shoshinkan]

So...nobody with any actual facts on the style/school? I agree that the presentation is not impressive, but I was hoping somebody 'round here had actual knowledge of what they're about.

Bueller? Bueller? :cool:


Its a fair point fella, they have a contac tnumber, i would just ring them and ask away - im often wrong on my assesment of these things but the website doesnt present it as a decent school IMO, not for me.

[askkarate]

Doesn't sound like a descent school? American Society of Karate has been around for over 30 years. We teach through the Parks and Recreation Departments, School Districts and several colleges in this Southeast part of Texas. I have been teaching 7 Credit Courses in Martial Arts and Kickboxing for 17 years at a local college. Finals, midterms, skills test, survivor camps, weapons camps are included. I am hurt with how you judge before you have even had any contact with Bill Gray-The Director of American Society of Karate. By the way Bill "Superfoot" Wallace has had his own system for years. And if your sister was in my class she received several class handouts explaining what the style was, how long we have been around and everything about us. Also that college class students have a choice to belt rank or not. It is stated that they can attend the tournaments, camps, and the Class Superfoot himself teaches for me when he comes to town to visit Mr. Gray or Mr. Wong if they so choose. It is not a requirement for a grade. My classes are full. My student learn good skills. We teach the art, sport and self defense aspects of KARATE. We have judo class some days, sparring class others, kata's (we have 6 required to rank plus musical and weapons kata's) not everything is listed about us in the website nor does it need to be. It is used for general information for our students. And if you had followed the links you would have found the Austin Society of Karate, Hill Country Karate, and East Texas American Society of Karate. All organizations that have branched out from our American Society of Karate. I usually end up with several Black Belts from other styles in my college credit courses every session. Maybe 1 out of 10 act as you write. Most are excited to share their knowledge and learn all about our style. Some even continue on toward Black Belt Level in our style. I know I did. And I am happy with that choice everyday I go to class and its packed with my students. Smiling talking and ready to learn another days worth of skills. I am sorry you have a limited amount of knowledge of the subject of Martial Arts and a limited amount of knowledge on the correct way of a Martial Artist. We are taught and we continue to pass it down the line that one Martial Artist is to never RUN DOWN anothers style. www.askakarate.com Not to be the largest but to be the best.

[Webmaster]

...kata's (we have 6 required to rank plus musical and weapons kata's) ...
Musical Kata! Why that real Karotty! Sign me up! :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

[TonyU]

You're right, everything is not put in the website. Now you calrified it for us the assesment now correct.

[Webmaster]

You're right, everything is not put in the website. Now you calrified it for us the assesment now correct.
Oh I don't know Tony. I could see you doing Gojushiho to Acky Breaky Heart. :D

[James O'Neill]

:laugh:

That was kinda harsh. But it was also very funny. Musical Kata must just piss some of y'all off - if you are serious about Karate as a method of self defense and a way of Life, how can you justify taking the Traditional part of the Art and making it over into some bloody metrosexual disco dance? Adding "Martial" techniques and experimenting I'll bet is acceptable. But having been here a short while it is obvious that musical Kata isn't going to win these folks any credibility around here :D

[Prince Loeffler]

Oh I don't know Tony. I could see you doing Gojushiho to Acky Breaky Heart. :D

That would ruin the Kata's timing..:D

[Webmaster]

That would ruin the Kata's timing..:D
So which tune would you pick? :confused:

[Cliff Hargrave]

Oh I don't know Tony. I could see you doing Gojushiho to Acky Breaky Heart. :D

No, Tony is more of the musical + video game sound effects type:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vJxY8SyL4WU

[Gordon Nore]

I looked at the web link that Chris posted, and I'm a bit confused. This picture appears on the site. Unless my bifocal prescription is way off, isn't that Bong Soo Han, the Hapkido practitioner?

http://askkarate.cmasdirect.com/images/html/centuryTheme11/style01/1.0/images/default/2.jpg

[Cliff Hargrave]

I looked at the web link that Chris posted, and I'm a bit confused. This picture appears on the site. Unless my bifocal prescription is way off, isn't that Bong Soo Han, the Hapkido practitioner?



That's from a Century Martial Arts Supply affiliate site. If you notice the URL changes when you click on the "Karate Gear" button. It's basically a template that Century uses for wholesale affiliates. People buy from the site, thinking they are buy from the karate school, but Century drop-ships the products to them. It's a way to make money without having to have an inventory.

[Gordon Nore]

That's from a Century Martial Arts Supply affiliate site. If you notice the URL changes when you click on the "Karate Gear" button. It's basically a template that Century uses for wholesale affiliates. People buy from the site, thinking they are buy from the karate school, but Century drop-ships the products to them. It's a way to make money without having to have an inventory.

...aah. Apart from the Century stuff, there isn't really much on the site, so one is left to assume that the site serves only to sell the karate gear.

[Rasputin]

...that one Martial Artist is to never RUN DOWN anothers style.

But...but what if you're wrong? What if you have been deceived all along, and what you have been taught is not really "karate" but something commercialized, something which has lost the original heart and soul of karate?

Wouldn't you want someone to tell you? Is it truly preferable that nobody steps up and counters what you have been told or offers a dissenting opinion?


I would want to know.

[Prince Loeffler]

So which tune would you pick? :confused:


Mandy by Barry Manilow.....:D :D :D :D

[Dennis Monk]

Actually, I think musical kata is an excellent way of accentuating your martial spirit though style, grace and imagination.

























Oh, and I also have this beautiful property in Phoenix for sale at a great price.
http://www.stevestill.com/images/oceanfront.jpg

[Prince Loeffler]

Ms. Gray,

May I respectfully ask you what style of "Karate" that your organization teaches ? I realized that its labeled and marketed as American " Karate " but there has to be some sort of Okinawan/Japanese "influenced" as a based that led to the creation of your current system.

Considering that ASK has been around for 30 years, I can assume that your organization has un-broken lineage. If so, can you share with us the origin of your art ?

Thank you for your prompt response regarding this inquiry.

[David Craik]

Surely they didn't perform 'musical kata' either. Thirty years ago if I had asked either my Wado or Shotokan sensei about musical kata they would have asked me what the hell I was talking about.

[TonyU]

Surely they didn't perform 'musical kata' either. Thirty years ago if I had asked either my Wado or Shotokan sensei about musical kata they would have asked me what the hell I was talking about.
If I ask any of the Okinawan senseis that now, I'd be surprised if I survive the enounter. :D

[Prince Loeffler]

I looked at the web link that Chris posted, and I'm a bit confused. This picture appears on the site. Unless my bifocal prescription is way off, isn't that Bong Soo Han, the Hapkido practitioner?

http://askkarate.cmasdirect.com/images/html/centuryTheme11/style01/1.0/images/default/2.jpg


Yest it is !

[CEB]

You big meanies!

[Mark Barlow]

Musical kata, Nascar Dogi, attempting to be a martial arts jack-of-all-trades...not my thing but then again if the students who are participating enjoy it and feel they're getting their moneys worth, more power to them.

My problem with all of this is that by posting a site on the internet, whether knowingly or not, you've invited comment and criticism. It's disingenuous to ask for attention and then claim that you're just a simple little band of happy travelers doing your own thing so please leave you alone. You had the opportunity to express yourself and your schools viewpoints. You preferred to take offense thus preventing an exchange of ideas.

[Webmaster]

You big meanies!
You are right. Perhaps Mrs. Gray would like to participate over at http://www.karate-budo.com/ since you'll are really into her type of Karate.

[Mark Barlow]

You are right. Perhaps Mrs. Gray would like to participate over at http://www.karate-budo.com/ since you'll are really into her type of Karate.

Come to think of it, we haven't gotten the folks at karate-budo a Christmas present yet and I think they'd love to rip this one open.:rolleyes:

[jwinch2]

Musical kata, Nascar Dogi, attempting to be a martial arts jack-of-all-trades...not my thing but then again if the students who are participating enjoy it and feel they're getting their moneys worth, more power to them.

My problem with all of this is that by posting a site on the internet, whether knowingly or not, you've invited comment and criticism. It's disingenuous to ask for attention and then claim that you're just a simple little band of happy travelers doing your own thing so please leave you alone. You had the opportunity to express yourself and your schools viewpoints. You preferred to take offense thus preventing an exchange of ideas.
Excellent point on the website Mark. Also I would add that if you are going to have a website and a FAQ link on it, actually placing some information on it might be a good place to start.

This conversation never would have occured in the first place if the ASK website had some decent information on the style, its founder, their lineage, rank requirements, etc... Currently, all they have is a link to one of their other schools which contains the same lack of information.

[Chunmonchek]

If I ask any of the Okinawan senseis that now, I'd be surprised if I survive the enounter. :D

Tony,

FYI, Toguchi Seikichi required many of his students to learn Okinawan dance (including my teacher), and.....Toguchi Sensei's Kata Hakutsuru was designed to be performed to specific Okinawan music.

So, although faaaar from common, Okinawa Karate and music are not always mutually exclusive!

Just stirring the pot...

Chris
Playin' the Devil's Advocate!

[TonyU]

Tony,

FYI, Toguchi Seikichi required many of his students to learn Okinawan dance (including my teacher), and.....Toguchi Sensei's Kata Hakutsuru was designed to be performed to specific Okinawan music.

So, although faaaar from common, Okinawa Karate and music are not always mutually exclusive!

Just stirring the pot...

Chris
Playin' the Devil's Advocate!
:stirthepot:

Ah yes, but one can argue that Okinawa karate kata and Okinawan Folk dancing have alot in common. But they did not make up their own kata and add music to make it showy for entertainment purpose. Big difference. :bunnyhop:

[Jason T Gatts]

:stirthepot:

Ah yes, but one can argue that Okinawa karate kata and Okinawan Folk dancing have alot in common. But they did not make up their own kata and add music to make it showy for entertainment purpose. Big difference. :bunnyhop:

Yeah, but remember this is "American Karate" (not Okinawan) - so for them Jimi Hendrix's Purple Haze or maybe the Eye of the Tiger works the same way.:D:



Joking of course.
I thought the mix still looked alittle lumpy.

[nupe357]

Hello All:

I think some of the questions about the ASK are legitimate. However, one may consider that the way those questions were approached may have illicited a negative reaction from some individuals. I'm not pointing fingers just speculating on the reasons for at least one of the reactions recieved regarding this topic.

I share the orginal questions because I have a son who I am considering enrolling in a A.S.K. affiliated school. I have sent them a message asking questions regarding their origins/linneage and how they developed their curriculum (including forms, etc). When I get a response I will post it here for those who are interested. It would be great if the member of A.S.K. who posted previously would simply answer these questions on this forum (thus saving me the trouble...:)

With Respect,

Nupe357
San Antonio, TX

[mh69]

Hello,

I ran across this forum on accident while searching for a picture of me with Bill Wallace a friend thought he saw on the web. Anyway...

I was a student of Bill Gray's from ~76-83 and trained under the ASK system, so I can verify he has been teaching Karate for 30 years. I can also verify his relationship with Bill Wallace as I attended two or three seminars in Houston (that featured Bill Wallace and were sponsored by ASK) over the course of my instruction.

I don't know enough about martial arts to comment on the style or origins of ASK, but I'll do my best to describe it and hope I don't sound too clueless. It was primarily kicking, punching, and striking -- very similar to my current TKD minus the axe/stretch kicks. I recall doing throwing and self-defense on occasions as well. I'd categorize the instruction as fitness/sport/defense and not a combat system; again similar to my current TKD instruction.

I recall Mr. Gray very favorably as a mature man who was obviously very skilled and an experienced instructor. While I agree with the people who said the internet representation of ASK is poor, the quality and size of the actual program I participated in were very professional.

Since my time with ASK, my involvement with MA has been "come and go". In trying several different programs and schools in several different cities over the last 20 years, I'd rate my experience with ASK very highly.


~Mike

[Snyper]

I apologize for bumping a very old thread, so my apologies to all.

I was a student of ASK for 5 years, and had a very good experience with them. From reading through all of the posts in this thread, many have posed very legitimate questions, that unfortunately, I cannot answer. However, I would like to reinforce some fundamental facts of this system that others have posted, first and foremost that the primary focus, from my experience, is on fitness/sport and self defense. The system is not a "traditional" schooling system that many martial artists are looking for that can trace it's lineage back for generations.

However, the system is solidly karate. I cannot say on which traditional karate style that the system builds from, but can best be catagorized as an American Karate style that pulls from several styles to build one hybrid style. The system brings in instructors from either outside the system or from within the system that hold dans in other martial arts styles, to cross train its students in basic style fundamentals, theories and tennants of other martial arts, such as Judo, Jeet-Kune-Do, Aikido, Krav Maga, and others. I personally received cross training in Judo, JKD and Krav Maga from ASK-provided instructors, that while did not give me any sort of proficiency in those arts, did give me insight on the core concepts and techniques used in those styles, which in turn allowed me to become a more proficient fighter in my style.

I will agree that the internet presentation of the school system is indeed very poor. I can remember it being commented about from within the system from several directions, but no change was ever made. The website is still the same as it was 10 years ago.

With that being said, in my opinion, the system is not a joke. While they are not what I would consider a traditional school with traceable lineage and generations-long history, I don't feel that it can be catagorized as McDojo either. The system has a very rigid structure, with a heavy emphasis placed on discipline, self defense, motivation, personal confidence, and application of knowledge and skills in the real world. The fighting style and techniques may not be the strongest in the world of MA, but their emphasis and techniques of real-world self defense, especially with their insistance on cross training in other styles, makes their self defense program one of the strongest I have seen. Their instructors are incredibly competent, and Bill Gray is very skilled and knowledgable.

Again, ASK is not "traditional" in some senses of what martial artists deem traditional, however the same people may be surprised in how traditional it really is. My experience with them was great, and I would recommend them to anyone.

Hope this helps.