Consciousness

[jailess]

It has a certain relevance to healing, so I'll start this thread on this forum: What does everyone think the basis for consciousness is?

Monotheistic religion (and most others) would have us believe that there is a human sould, an immutable part of us unique to ourselves, which carries on after the body dies; Others have noted that Consciousness could be an epi-phenomenon of complex neural activity; I favour the idea of the consciousness Memeplex, which I'll elaborate on later if no one else does (I should be revising right now!).

What does everyone think?

-Jame.

[lightninrod]

Monotheistic religion (and most others) would have us believe that there is a human sould, an immutable part of us unique to ourselves, which carries on after the body dies; Others have noted that Consciousness could be an epi-phenomenon of complex neural activity; I favour the idea of the consciousness Memeplex, which I'll elaborate on later if no one else does (I should be revising right now!).
Uhhhh... What did he say Beavis???? Uhhhh...? Something about concious Memo-plexity or sumthin' ???? Uhhhh....

Whew! Stretch my ligual circuits whydonchya!!! I just love textbook-speak! It sound so complex!!! ;)

Well... This is one hellava interesting subject for me. The nature of conciousness is about as easy to grasp as is water vapor; but that's what makes it fun to discuss. Let me start by saying that much of the following will be my own personal opinions, based partly on personal experience and largely upon things which I have read abouthere and there. Therefore, anyone who wants to ask me for studies which support and/or re-enforce my opinions are barking up the wrong tree. So there's no point in asking - OK?
Where to begin? Basically, I think that it is a fundamental mistake to try nailing "conciousness" to a particular concept or physical organ. I believe that conciousness exists simultaniously on multiple levels - all of which overlap and are more or less conciously accessible, depending on one's perspective and/or state of mind at any given time. (Perspective and state of mind are, to me, very important to this discussion.)
Foremost, we have "waking conciousness". This is what we experience when we wake up every morning and continue to experience throughout the day until we sleep again. This conciousness (for most people) disappears when we sleep. (Or die - for that matter.)
Under this (not secondarily, as it is all simultaneous) is the "sub"-concious mind. This would be the part of us which is not so immediately accessible, but which manifests itself in dreams, and which largely determines our behavior as we accumulate experience in life. This would be the part of us which determines Pavlonian response, predetermined emotional response (very similar to Pavlonian response), and which is responsible for the sudden recall of information in cases where we know we remember something, but it escapes our notice until we stop thinking so strongly about it and it just "pops up" later. It's sort of like an adaptive operating system for the brain.
Underneath this is where we get really far out. This is where, I believe, the "realm of the spirit" lies. (To be cliche-ish.) This is where, I believe, chi/ki exists. This is where we get the fabled "awareness of the unknown". Examples of this level are numerous. For the most obvious example, observe, if you ever get the opportunity, the 5th dan test in Bujinkan. Here, we have people responding to a stimulus which they can't see or hear, and which they don't conciously feel. Yet, they somehow avoid the cut due to the tester's real intention to hurt them. If conciousness begins and ends with the brain, then how is this intention both felt and reacted to without the concious knowledge of the testee?
Another example would be near-death experience. Many people have come back from "dying" with knowledge of happenings in other locales which were simultaneous with their "unconcious" state. Many of these instances have been documented and verified, yet remain unexplained to this date. How did these people know what was going on in other rooms/hallways where they were not?
Yet another example is "psychic" experience. There are numerous instances where real, hard-core police detectives have been at a dead end concerning some murder case or another. Yet one day some psychic calls with information which is immediately discounted but is later verified to the point that the detectives were left scratching their heads over the unexplainable similarities. Interestingly, numerous "dead-end' cases have been resolved due to this "phenomenon". We had an example of this here in Oklahoma, not too long ago, where some psychic called from out-of-state and described to detectives the exact scene where a missing girl's body could be found. Not having any better leads, the police checked it out quite thoroughly and found the girl's body in a locale which had been exactly described to them.
Obviously, unless one chooses to overlook the obvious evidence, many phenomenae (correct plural?) exist which contradict the idea that conciousness is strictly a neural phenomenon. Many people, including myself, have had experiences which would seemingly contradict such a notion. Interestingly, in spite of the overwhelming evidence, many people still say "I don't believe in it." Sometimes these are people whom I know, who present all the facts to me, and still say this in spite of the evidence which they provided. This represents, to me, the general refusal of people to acknowledge that which is outside of their normal frame of reference, in spite of the fact that the evidence stands contrarily to their belief.
Even more interesting to me is the fact that many people in the martial arts choose to ignore the spiritual root upon which their art was founded and insist that "chi doesn't exist", when in fact their art was founded upon chi/ki and their level of practice is nowhere near that upon which such a foundation was lain. How many people in aikido have experienced the "light" which directed Ueshiba? Who can say that they have experienced his level of practice? Who can argue with Masaaki Hatsumi, a man who is able to respond to an unseen attack? What about the samurai masters who predicted their own deaths in their old age? Examples abound. Discount them at your own peril. After all, the only penalty is ignorance! Such an ugly monster it is!!!

Sincerely,
Justin Mears

[Harlan]

I consider consciousness to be the experience of awareness. It is a mutable state, and rather than consider it a fixed point I consider it to be something that manifests along a continuum of states.

An interesting book on this topic is 'Zen and the Brain.' You might want to read up on the Tibetan concept of 'bardo'.

[lightninrod]

I consider consciousness to be the experience of awareness. It is a mutable state, and rather than consider it a fixed point I consider it to be something that manifests along a continuum of states.
That's exactly what I was getting at! I'm just waaaayyy to wordy sometimes. I'll check out the book.

Justin Mears

[Harlan]

I've found the Tibetan Buddhist traditions very helpful. While it is within a religious context, they have a very developed understanding and terminology for 'consciousness'. Try reading "Luminous Emptiness: Understanding the Tibetian Book of the Dead" by Francesca Fremantle as well.

[lightninrod]

I've found the Tibetan Buddhist traditions very helpful. While it is within a religious context, they have a very developed understanding and terminology for 'consciousness'. Try reading "Luminous Emptiness: Understanding the Tibetian Book of the Dead" by Francesca Fremantle as well.
Thank you. I will.
I have read the Dalai Lama's The Way to Freedom and enjoyed it. I think I will have to read it again, as it has been a long time and I don't remember much of it. Being somewhat Taoism-oriented, I very much appreciate the non-religious philosophy of Buddhism, as it has many similarities to Taoist philosophy. Since I just got paid today, I think I'll just slip on over to Amazon and see if they have these books.

[Rasputin]

I'm just waaaayyy to wordy sometimes.

Noooooo... (http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=paragraph)

[lightninrod]

Noooooo... (http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=paragraph)
Yeaaahhhh.... What can I say? The more I say, the more I feel the need to explain. At least I recognise the problem and am attemting to do something about it! :o I'll get better! I promise!!!

[Tang-Soo-Architect]

Consciousness is the opposite of un-consciousness.
Consciousness is good because it is difficult to do much while unconscious.

:D