View Full Version : Motivations to become a martial artist
As an assistant instructor in martial arts, and a guy, I readily understand and relate to the myriad reasons -- be they related to competition, fitness, self-esteem and/or self-preservation -- why men take up martial arts.
For women, however, I think that there's less dimension in the minds of those in the general public, not to mention in the martial arts (being a male-dominated arena), concerning why women initially choose to train -- even less understanding concerning what drives women to excel long-term in the martial arts. In other words, there's nothing wrong with the popular notion that women primarily take up martial arts out of real or perceived necessity -- i.e. having been or fearing becoming a victim of violent crime -- since that is a major motivator for either gender. It's just kind of simplistic. In public forums such as these, not to mention in martial arts schools themselves, men (who by default are relegated to observing women's experiences vs. understanding them first hand) often act as mouthpieces for women, albeit usually with good intentions. In any case, I realize from speaking with the women with whom I train that there's a lot more debth and breadth to the answers to the following questions than the martial arts community as a whole is aware of:
Why do women initially take up the martial arts?
What motivates women to continue to develop as martial artists -- how do women martial artist's motivations evolve over time and experience?
Look forward to your enlightenments!
Why do women initially take up the martial arts?
What motivates women to continue to develop as martial artists -- how do women martial artist's motivations evolve over time and experience?
Look forward to your enlightenments!
Good question. Unfortunately I will have to bore everyone to tears as I really had no motivation.
I was 14 and my HS required participation in a club. I hated all the choices and by default landed in a CMA club. :D
Loved it from day 1.
As for continuing, I just liked my experiences and continued as I moved from HS to college to adult life. I wasn't style specific - pretty much whatever I could find nearby that was reputable and affordable. Eventually I just settled into TKD and HKD and have been very fortunate to meet some great people.
*yawn* :p
One of the biggest reasons I hear as to why women won't join is they think it is rough. ..."All that fighting and stuff."
AndrewSimonsen
03-07-2007, 23:05
I've seen you compete, you are rough. :t2:
. . . Loved it from day 1.
As for continuing, I just liked my experiences and continued as I moved from HS to college to adult life. I wasn't style specific - pretty much whatever I could find nearby that was reputable and affordable. Eventually I just settled into TKD and HKD and have been very fortunate to meet some great people. . . .
Ah, this is interesting! So many of us (and I'm guilty as charged) noodle on the differences and perceived efficacy of one style or technique over another, whereas what you wrote above implies that you see common traits of value to you in all martial arts.
One of the biggest reasons I hear as to why women won't join is they think it is rough. ..."All that fighting and stuff."
Do you feel there's something inherently different about women martial artists vs. women in general? Are female martial artists typically born (i.e. like you, love it from day one)? Have you seen a fair number of women develop a taste for the martial arts over time? Sadly, I've found that if a woman doesn't seem predisposed to the physicality of the art from the get-go -- no matter how much she may appreciate the art's merits -- she doesn't stick for more than a few classes (whereas I've seen a handful of men with the same initial aversions stick it out for months or even years before quitting).
Musubi Dojo
03-08-2007, 12:44
A theory I've read about....
Women handle stress differently than men. Instead of a "fight or flight" response women more often respond with a "tend and befriend" reaction that makes violence unthinkable. Of course there are exceptions to every rule.
http://www.medicinenet.com/script/main/art.asp?articlekey=79584
Many women shying away from martial arts because of "All that fighting and stuff." would make sense.
Another theory from that SCA essay Rory suggested stated that for guys, 90% of the hits we take while growing up are in fun whereas for women, 90% of the hits they take are actually meant to hurt and terrorize.
Consequently, it's easier for guys to find it fun to take a beating and to dish it back out on their buddies. We're conditioned to find it fun.
Women, on the other hand, experience the same experience totally differently.
Of course this is based on stereotypes/archtypes, but still, I think it has a lot of merit to it.
I know my youngest sisters won't take *@#$ from anybody, probably because they are twins and had to compete with each other and probably because I would "play" jiu jitsu with them (which usually resulted in me getting dog-piled). My older sister is the opposite but we never played rough when we were little.
I'm curious - Eliz, did you grow up with brothers, male cousins, playing outside, nailing each other with snowballs, etc.?
Musubi Dojo
03-08-2007, 14:55
Are women who participate in MA 'looked down on" by other women?
Is there a peer pressure thing there?
I can't speak for other women so I'm answering the questions from my own perspective. Not sure how enlightening but...
1. Why do women initially take up the martial arts?
In my case, I wanted to get more exercise. I was getting tired of swimming, aerobics classes seemed pointless and I couldn't find a dance class that liked. Then I found a Hapkido class flyer and the rest is history :up:
2. What motivates women to continue to develop as martial artists -- how do women martial artist's motivations evolve over time and experience?
There are probably hundreds of reasons why I continue. But, in the end I think what it boils down to something feels wrong and I miss it when I'm not.
3. Are women who participate in MA 'looked down on" by other women? Is there a peer pressure thing there?
I'm 5 ft. 9 in. so there aren't many women who can look down on me :wink2: . Truefully, I don't know and don't really care. To quote Dr. Seuss "Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind."
I've seen you compete, you are rough.
:p
what you wrote above implies that you see common traits of value to you in all martial arts.
I like most styles. What I look for is the quality of the students and the instructor. I just like to be around people who are real people....not people who are caught up on some fancy notion of Ultimate Supreme Power MuHaHa :rolleyes:
I'm curious - Eliz, did you grow up with brothers, male cousins....
Yea, you could say that!!! :laugh: :laugh: I am the token female.
Are women who participate in MA 'looked down on" by other women?
I have never felt that, but outside the dojang I am so completely average I am not sure it is even an issue. Someone may ask me how I stay in shape and I would respond MA’s. Mild curiosity is all I have ever been approached with.
A theory I've read about....
Women handle stress differently than men. Instead of a "fight or flight" response women more often respond with a "tend and befriend" reaction that makes violence unthinkable. Of course there are exceptions to every rule.
http://www.medicinenet.com/script/main/art.asp?articlekey=79584
Many women shying away from martial arts because of "All that fighting and stuff." would make sense.
I came back to this post as I have never heard that theory before. I have immediate flashbacks to the foodstore.....the 15 item or less isle......and two blue haired old bitties having it out. :laugh:
That is a weekly accurance it seems. Never have I seen such violence in women as I do at the food store. Thank God for self check out. Zero on the entertainment scale, but great for the stress free factor. :rolleyes:
In all seriousness, I don't know. Seems women can be plenty violent when it suits them, yet they are hesitant to lay into a heavy bag.
Interesting point.
From this article (http://psychologytoday.com/articles/pto-20000901-000021.html) titled "Tend and Befriend" (written by a female journalist concerning research by a female psychologist) in PsychologyToday.com:
". . . compared to males, females' physical aggression and fear-related behaviors are less intense and more 'cerebral'--they are displayed in response to specific circumstances and are less tied to physiological arousal. So while both sexes share the capacity for fight or flight, females seem to use it less. . . ."
For example perhaps . . . . . I've never seen a woman without prior background in an art that involves throws and/or groundwork get too animated about the prospect of trying out jujutsu during an initial visit to the dojo, whereas a small number of male newbies have displayed an eager dive-in-and-let's-see-what's-under-the-hood attitude about getting on the mat.
And so maybe this conclusion presented in the article also supports Elizabeth's observation below:
. . . Seems women can be plenty violent when it suits them, yet they are hesitant to lay into a heavy bag. . . ."
Now I'm curious about a woman's internal dialogue when approaching training in a martial art for the first time. What does she say to herself as she she stands in front of the heavy bag for the first time, let alone the first time she crosses the threshold into a school (setting aside specific motivations for training for a moment)?
. . . I know my youngest sisters won't take *@#$ from anybody, probably because they are twins and had to compete with each other and probably because I would "play" jiu jitsu with them (which usually resulted in me getting dog-piled). My older sister is the opposite but we never played rough when we were little.
I'm curious - Eliz, did you grow up with brothers, male cousins, playing outside, nailing each other with snowballs, etc.?
This is less high-brow, but really makes sense!
Musubi Dojo
03-09-2007, 10:43
However, I think Erik's onto something less high-brow but really sensible (which Elizabeth's upbringing supports). If you're used to trading lumps with male kin your whole life, seems it would lower the mental hurdles as a woman approaches a martial art.
That's the whole "nature vs nurture argumement." (Upon which I'm an avid fence sitter)
My sister was particularly vicious as a child, became introverted and timid as an adolecsent (she got a lot of unwanted attention from men at a young age, looking a lot older than she was) Then I introduced her to jujutsu and then she swung back the other way with a huge confidence boost....nearly breaking my leg and dislocating my elbow during one training session...:laugh:
Depending on any given day/situation it could be:
- This sucks.
- I'm too (*insert choice of: tired, old, fat, out-of-shape, etc.*) for this.
- I can't/don't want to do this.
And usually accompanied with a heavy dose of panic, embarrassment and shaking with fear.
Now I'm curious about a woman's internal dialogue when approaching training in a martial art for the first time. What does she say to herself as she she stands in front of the heavy bag for the first time, let alone the first time she crosses the threshold into a school (setting aside specific motivations for training for a moment)?
Hardest part: first steps across a new hall.
Hate to train...love to have trained.
Depending on any given day/situation it could be:
- This sucks.
- I'm too (*insert choice of: tired, old, fat, out-of-shape, etc.*) for this.
- I can't/don't want to do this.
And usually accompanied with a heavy dose of panic, embarrassment and shaking with fear.
So Narda --- What keeps you coming back for more??
. . . 2. What motivates women to continue to develop as martial artists -- how do women martial artist's motivations evolve over time and experience?
There are probably hundreds of reasons why I continue. But, in the end I think what it boils down to something feels wrong and I miss it when I'm not. . . .
Yeah, good point. Perhaps the further one goes in a given art, the less any gender-specific motivators (that may be there when people are new to the art) apply.
A good teacher.
What about his/her teaching style appeals to you, motivates you -- especially in light of your candid comments about how you experience training?
Without getting too personal, I'd say the situation is 'just right' for my interests and needs. It's a truism...'to the right student, the right teacher.' A mix of research, and good fortune.
Brian Dugger
03-09-2007, 14:30
That's the whole "nature vs nurture argumement." (Upon which I'm an avid fence sitter)
My sister was particularly vicious as a child, became introverted and timid as an adolecsent (she got a lot of unwanted attention from men at a young age, looking a lot older than she was) Then I introduced her to jujutsu and then she swung back the other way with a huge confidence boost....nearly breaking my leg and dislocating my elbow during one training session...:laugh:
True to an agree. My younger sib lives in Chicago and works as a fitness instructor. The relatives on the Thai side of the house say she looks like a hockey player, but not as ugly. She is always talkin' up this bokken "fitness" class and how it strengthens and builds a person up. See it's all this "stuff and fluff" external malarky which kinda makes the hair on the back of my neck brizzle up. I told her go see Akira Tohei's group, I think that dojo is on Michigan Ave. They'll show you some bokken work! But alas, she hasn't gone because it is not "in", "fad", "money" , etc . . . And its work, diligence and patience, etc . . . This girl I've shown a number of things and she can learn it rather quickly. "But that hurts, that's painful---wha?! fall down on that foamy thing--why?! Why?! would anybody want to do that?" My response has always been to her, "We're not anybody.":up:
Why do women initially take up the martial arts?
Well, for me, it was a combination of Power Rangers, Chuck Norris, and WMAC Masters. And, I wanted to lose weight, too.
What motivates women to continue to develop as martial artists -- how do women martial artist's motivations evolve over time and experience?
I'm still doing TKD because I love it! When I miss class, I just feel...wrong. And I want to get to black belt. I've been told that's wear the real fun begins.
Without getting too personal, I'd say the situation is 'just right' for my interests and needs. It's a truism...'to the right student, the right teacher.' A mix of research, and good fortune.
Fair enough. . . . . Well . . . Perhaps this isn't Narda's situation, but I've noticed at least two recent instances on other threads in which women cited cultivation of a full-fledged relationship with their respective teachers (in one case, the relationship had apparently come to fruition, whereas in the other case it was wishful thinking on the part of the student) as a key motivation to train. Not sure how common this is, but I've seen it attempted (the woman left the school shortly after it was obvious no one was interested).
True to an agree. My younger sib lives in Chicago and works as a fitness instructor. The relatives on the Thai side of the house say she looks like a hockey player, but not as ugly. She is always talkin' up this bokken "fitness" class and how it strengthens and builds a person up. See it's all this "stuff and fluff" external malarky which kinda makes the hair on the back of my neck brizzle up. I told her go see Akira Tohei's group, I think that dojo is on Michigan Ave. They'll show you some bokken work! But alas, she hasn't gone because it is not "in", "fad", "money" , etc . . . And its work, diligence and patience, etc . . .
Yeah, it's pretty strange thinking of a bokken as something akin to a 2-lb. dumbell.
. . . This girl I've shown a number of things and she can learn it rather quickly. "But that hurts, that's painful---wha?! fall down on that foamy thing--why?! Why?! would anybody want to do that?" My response has always been to her, "We're not anybody.":up:
A devoted martial artist is hard to come by -- but a devoted female martial artist is a truly rare commodity!
Fair enough. . . . . Well . . . Perhaps this isn't Narda's situation, but I've noticed at least two recent instances on other threads in which women cited cultivation of a full-fledged relationship with their respective teachers (in one case, the relationship had apparently come to fruition, whereas in the other case it was wishful thinking on the part of the student) as a key motivation to train. Not sure how common this is, but I've seen it attempted (the woman left the school shortly after it was obvious no one was interested).
My observation is that some women do start MA hoping to find a man or to share their man's interest but, generally they don't seem to stick around long.
Darn straight this isn't!
Fair enough. . . . . Well . . . Perhaps this isn't Narda's situation, but I've noticed at least two recent instances on other threads in which women cited cultivation of a full-fledged relationship with their respective teachers (in one case, the relationship had apparently come to fruition, whereas in the other case it was wishful thinking on the part of the student) as a key motivation to train. Not sure how common this is, but I've seen it attempted (the woman left the school shortly after it was obvious no one was interested).
I think your question is basically a variation on one question that comes up in different forms. That question being 'do women have different reasons for being in MA'...and that is predicated on the bias that women are...well...different.
Admittedly, I'm a beginner...but I don't put the world of MA into two camps: male vs. female. I see everyone as falling somewhere along a continuum (sp?) of ability and fitness...and gender 'doesn't compute'.
. . . Admittedly, I'm a beginner...but I don't put the world of MA into two camps: male vs. female. I see everyone as falling somewhere along a continuum (sp?) of ability and fitness...and gender 'doesn't compute'.
Narda --- You being a beginner further explains to the rest of us why you're grateful to have a quality teacher to work through the obstacles you mentioned earlier in this thread. Thanks for the clarification.
. . . I think your question is basically a variation on one question that comes up in different forms. That question being 'do women have different reasons for being in MA'...and that is predicated on the bias that women are...well...different. . . .
Yeah, I think that's one thing that's clear by the majority of the responses, again, especially for long-term practitioners: once you're bit, you're bit, and over time gender issues matter less if not at all, as mentioned earlier in this thread.
OK . . . . . It might make it easier for some folks to look at this using a reverse example, say, a man who takes up ballet. Now, growing up as a guy in the U.S. -- flat out few things say "sissy" more than the notion of donning tights and flitting around a dance floor or stage! I'm assuming many men who take up ballet (perhaps the majority) are in it for the same reasons as most of the women, i.e. it felt right when they tried it, they enjoy it, and they miss doing it when not doing it -- reasonable answer for martial arts, ballet or any endeavor (as a number of the responses to this thread reveal). Maybe a few sought to score a date with a ballerina -- fine. However, there are specific gender- and/or vocation-based reasons, not tied to the ballet itself, why certain men do ballet. Herschel Walker is a well-known American football player (running back) who won the Heisman Trophy and went on to a productive career in the National Football League (NFL). If there ever was a man who broke the mold of the image of a danseur, it would be this guy! Anyway, Walker studied ballet specifically to improve his balance and flexibility as assets for evading defenses and dealing with the punishment of being a professional running back -- absolutely gender-specific reasons for taking up ballet! He did got so into ballet, however, that he ended up performing with organized ballet companies. My own teacher, who's a big guy and does not look light on his feet, has amazing footwork for a man his size! He tells us that his father encouraged him when he was young to take up ballet as it would improve his footwork in martial arts, and decades later, the fruits of that advice show on the mat every day.
Hopefully this helps clarify the intended spirit of this thread. :bow:
My observation is that some women do start MA hoping to find a man or to share their man's interest but, generally they don't seem to stick around long.
Agreed.
". . . compared to males, females' physical aggression and fear-related behaviors are less intense and more 'cerebral'--they are displayed in response to specific circumstances and are less tied to physiological arousal. So while both sexes share the capacity for fight or flight, females seem to use it less. . . ."
For example perhaps . . . . . I've never seen a woman without prior background in an art that involves throws and/or groundwork get too animated about the prospect of trying out jujutsu during an initial visit to the dojo, whereas a small number of male newbies have displayed an eager dive-in-and-let's-see-what's-under-the-hood attitude about getting on the mat.
And so maybe this conclusion presented in the article also supports Elizabeth's observation below:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eliz Seuferling
. . . Seems women can be plenty violent when it suits them, yet they are hesitant to lay into a heavy bag. . . ."
Good Point!!
As for internal dialogue when approaching something new, I usually just go in with my eyes wide open and my mouth shut. I do remember when I started HKD wondering if the dobok I was wearing would be acceptable. It was a heavy white Iron Man, but I already knew in advance that it wasn't the super heavy Judo style doboks the other students wore. Dumb, I know. *rolleyes*
. . . As for internal dialogue when approaching something new, I usually just go in with my eyes wide open and my mouth shut. I do remember when I started HKD wondering if the dobok I was wearing would be acceptable. It was a heavy white Iron Man, but I already knew in advance that it wasn't the super heavy Judo style doboks the other students wore. Dumb, I know. *rolleyes*
We do shiatsu as well as jujutsu at our dojo, and one of our shiatsu clients is a TKD practitioner. She likes to take class with us every now and then for self defense training, and wears her TKD uniform. It's so lightweight that I'm afraid to grab the lapel, sleeves, etc.; so typically I modify my techniques so I don't have to grab her uniform (as far as I know, she's not fluent in multiple Korean arts like you :bow: ). Are you still wearing the Iron Man, or did you end up switching to something heavier?
So how much does fashion consciousness play into a woman's thoughts when beginning to train? I know that BuJin Design offers hakama and dogi specifically cut for women, and since those have been offered for some time, I assume there's a healthy enough market for them.
Are you still wearing the Iron Man, or did you end up switching to something heavier?
So how much does fashion consciousness play into a woman's thoughts when beginning to train? I know that BuJin Design offers hakama and dogi specifically cut for women, and since those have been offered for some time, I assume there's a healthy enough market for them.
:laugh: The Iron Man's are VERY heavy - not traditional v-neck TKD. When new, they will practically stand on their own. Although plenty heavy enough to withstand HKD, it just was not the style dobok the others were wearing. Once I was sure I liked HKD, I quickly secured the style dobok that everyone else had. It is actually more like a Judo dogi.
I think women are fashion conscience when it comes to wearing what everyone else is wearing. I think men are the same. A lot of men have asked me if it is ok to wear this, that, or the other. Maybe men don't worry about it as much? I was WORRIED. :D
Edit: The TKD school I am in does not favor the traditional V-neck doboks at all. Most wear heavy weight jackets and pants. I think competitors like the V-necks.
Why do women initially take up the martial arts?
I wanted to give something new a try; I wanted to become more self-confident and there was also the aspect of self-defence.
What motivates women to continue to develop as martial artists -- how do women martial artist's motivations evolve over time and experience?
Because I feel good when I train and it makes a lot of fun. For the second part of this question I can't say, because I haven't trained very long now; there are times were I am highly motivated and times where my motivation is less...
. . . I think women are fashion conscience when it comes to wearing what everyone else is wearing. I think men are the same. A lot of men have asked me if it is ok to wear this, that, or the other. Maybe men don't worry about it as much? I was WORRIED. :D
I think what you said about the difference in fashion consciousness between the sexes is generally on the money. I've also noticed that women worry more about smelling nice/clean on the mat (e.g. shower, lotion, etc.) beforehand, whereas a lot of guys figure a little must and dust still rates acceptable.
. . . For the second part of this question I can't say, because I haven't trained very long now; there are times were I am highly motivated and times where my motivation is less...
Are you motivated by long-term goals in your training Nadine, or do you take your training more one day at a time?
seidogirl
03-10-2007, 21:21
I took up martial arts for the first time about a year ago when I was 39. I wanted to meet new people, do something athletic and learn something new. I was also looking for a challenge and was tired of gyms and aerobics where you just do the same thing over and over and aren't really learning anything useful. I had played a lot of sports when I was younger but never had the time for martial arts and I'm so glad I finally got into it.
There are a lot of women at my dojo and we are mostly around the same age, so I think that had a lot to do with why I picked this particular school. But the guys are great too. That's what keeps me coming back. The social part of karate is very important to me. We spend so much time together and it's like a little family.
I think what you said about the difference in fashion consciousness between the sexes is generally on the money. I've also noticed that women worry more about smelling nice/clean on the mat (e.g. shower, lotion, etc.) beforehand, whereas a lot of guys figure a little must and dust still rates acceptable.
I find this funny because no one is concerned with this where I train. We all sweat and stink and nobody cares. But maybe BJJ and Judo are different since you get more "personal" than we do in karate.
I think what you said about the difference in fashion consciousness between the sexes is generally on the money. I've also noticed that women worry more about smelling nice/clean on the mat (e.g. shower, lotion, etc.) beforehand, whereas a lot of guys figure a little must and dust still rates acceptable.
The first post I ever made on Budoseek was regarding Hapkido uniforms specifically when was it okay to wear black pants :laugh:
. . . I had played a lot of sports when I was younger but never had the time for martial arts and I'm so glad I finally got into it. . . .
Interesting. . . . . Wonder how many other women in martial arts come from a sports-playing background.
. . . We all sweat and stink and nobody cares. But maybe BJJ and Judo are different since you get more "personal" than we do in karate.
Hehe . . . . . Olfactory overload occurs easier at grappling range than striking range! :eek: :D
. . . Herschel Walker . . .Forgot to mention that, in addition to excelling in football and ballet, he's apparently quite a Tae Kwon Do practitioner (Wikipedia says he's a 6th-degree black belt).
Are you motivated by long-term goals in your training Nadine, or do you take your training more one day at a time?
I think both, I'm motivated to improve my technical skills and mental skills in long-term run, but I am also motivated to train together with my friends one day at a time.
DragonMind
03-11-2007, 15:39
The first post I ever made on Budoseek was regarding Hapkido uniforms specifically when was it okay to wear black pants :laugh:And as I recall the general consensus was "especially that time of the month" :laugh:
A buddy of mine, whose husband tried for a long time to get her to try out martial arts (he regularly trains), eventually acquiesced (she checked out her first class rife with apprehension about the physicality of the training, citing hubby's bruises as reasons to ask "why??"). She noted that some of the moves reminded her of dance she'd previously studied, which greatly upped the appeal of martial arts in her mind. Plus, she gets to train with her husband and kids at the same school, so training time is family time. She now has rank in two styles, and is as die-hard a martial arts devotee as anyone I know.
Angharad
03-18-2007, 19:34
I think a lot of women get into Martial Arts primarily for fitness, instead of wanting to be like Bruce Lee. For me, a friend of mine joined a club and wanted somebody else to go with her. So I did, and stuck with it. I think a lot of men join for fitness, but are much more influenced by the media of tough Martial Art actors.
I think a lot of women get into Martial Arts primarily for fitness, instead of wanting to be like Bruce Lee. For me, a friend of mine joined a club and wanted somebody else to go with her. So I did, and stuck with it. I think a lot of men join for fitness, but are much more influenced by the media of tough Martial Art actors.
Angharad --- Do you still primarily train for fitness, or has that motivation become balanced out by other positive things you gain from training in martial arts? Also, your martial arts resume is quite interesting. How did you arrive at that particular combination of arts to study (ranges from a quintessential competition art to a venerable no-frills combat system)?
I joined for something new to try. Team sports don't appeal to me as much as individual pursuits.
That being said, I stay for the comraderie. It motivates me.
Musubi Dojo
03-27-2007, 11:37
Hi Karen!
Your avater looks familiar........hmmmmmmmm......:D
Welcome aboard!
c
Speaking of comrades....
Hi Chris! Congratulations to you and yours-- I'm sure you are both ecstatic and very exhausted LOL!
Answering this belatedly - I just got in to MA because I'd been curious about it for a long time and just never had time to fit it in until recently. I have been doing sports since I was a kid and as an adult, rode horses competitive up until a few years ago. I got out of that for a while and was thinking of either buying another horse and getting back into riding or doing something completely different; I decided to try MA (no art in particular) and serendipitously found my current school.
As for fashion - lol - see my current post about women's gis. I am no fashonista but I do want something that fits. In men's gi's of my "size," I look like a weight loss "after" picture.
I will check your thread out next. As for the horses, our very own KayJay might have disagreed. :rolleyes: I think her love of horses and love of MA's are pretty equal.
I will check your thread out next. As for the horses, our very own KayJay might have disagreed. :rolleyes: I think her love of horses and love of MA's are pretty equal.
I have chatted a bit with KayJay about horses in the past. I think she and I did the same sport primarily, in fact! I loved it but fell out of it when my older horse retired and life took a bit of a turn.
LadyPhoenix
11-28-2007, 02:30
This is my first post and I find this community very open, respectful and insightful. I could go on but I should stick with the topic. I'm not sure if it's too late to reply this but anyway, here I go.
First of all, I would like you to know that English is my third language and I hope you understand some of it. I'll try to be understandable but I'm sure it won't be much of a headache....hopefully so.
Koshu, women have participated Martial-Arts since the creation. In Asia, women had to learn some of it to protect their house and their family too while men went to war. They don't learn much of it but they did learn. I'm not saying it happened all the century that had passed because there were times that woman liked to be what society was acceptable: woman have to be and do this and man have to be and do this. It depends on the country.
In this time, we are still searching to be equal with men. It wasn't a long time ago that the rights of women happened. Compared all the years that had passed before that and until just recently (around 60 years ago)... It's still just beginning. Obviously, there are still men who want to treat women how it should be treated in “ancient way” (sorry to say that) and there are women who still wishes that men treat that way (negative or positive way). For example, some men would treat a girl like a whore and others like a princess. There are, of course, levels how to treat a person but it’s just basic. Now those women have an equal right for many things...but is it the same thing with physical match? After all, men have considered that only men can do “wars”...?
So,
Why do women initially take up the martial arts?
What motivates women to continue to develop as martial artists -- how do women martial artist's motivations evolve over time and experience?
It’s simply normal since we have the rights to do that. It depends on woman if they feel comfortable to be around with men. If both man and woman are physically fit, it’s a fact that a woman is weaker physically than a man. That can prove wrong because, like men, there are women who can beat a man. I believe it depends all in your head as in emotionally, technically, etc. and in your heart whoever gender you are. If you’re looking women's experience as to why how they began Martial-Art, I could give you myself as an example too. Either way, I’m not sure of your questions.
I began Martial-Arts when I was 8 years old. I didn’t stick longer in the same school like I wished to be. Sucks big time. I initially started to be interested or to be motivated in MA because of a cousin in Guatemala. He started Kempo since he was 4 years old and got black belt when he was 20 years old. Anyway, he had yellow belt (6-7 years old) when I came in (8). I don’t know why most Martial-Artist have forgotten that getting black belt in Karate takes time. Anyway, so my little brother and I went to his big school. It was still under constructions and there were no bathroom for girls yet. So this Sensei came in with a really serious and strict look.
My family talked to him that we wanted to join his school. I remembered that he talked to me personally that I’ll be the first girl in his school. He said to me that his school is serious and once you enter his school is for life. That there’s no playing around like a girl and that I had to work hard to reach my goal. It didn’t frighten me because it wasn’t an order; it was more like an advice and a warning in a sympathy way with a serious tone.
There were two reasons why I accepted: I sensed Sensei an honest and sympathic man and he did support me all the way....the hard way. And the other... because of my cousin. He believed that a girl is weak and there were always competition between us. Well, actually, I was always looking for a fight and a moment to prove him wrong. He always send his “messages face” that I will never win. So, yeah, obviously, my motivation was proving them that I can do it and I did really like Kempo. A year later, I had to go to Canada and my Sensei said, always with his serious look, that I have to continue to train hard.
Months later after that, I joined Karate Kick Boxing for almost 2 years but they changed places and as an independent kid, I got confused so I left.
Four years later, I joined Karate Okinawa for two years but the school got fire and they translated me to another school which called, Karate Kyokushinkai. I didn’t like that place. It was disrespectful but the atmosphere was tough which I like, so I endured until my inscription was expired.
A year later, I had problems and I didn’t much trained for 4 years. Then I found the “light” and wanted to return again, so I entered Kung-fu. I wanted to do something different. Fang Shen Do caught my eyes. Although, different than any school I went through, but it was all I ever wanted. I heard bad reputation from them because of Sijo been a fraud and all the money they take. I knew that Kung-Fu always cost a lot so that’s not a problem for me. Whatever the stories they had from the past, it doesn’t matter for me because I can see what is honest and what is not. That’s my point of view.
However, I stayed for a year and had to move another place far from them (1 hour in car). I am "self-training" now without them. I will finish what I have to do here and I will return there once again. That’s a first time I do that for returning...
So that’s my story and...yeah, unfortunately, my cousin still hit hard every time I go there for a vacation. It’s kind of knock-out. He still always wins. That's what I like about him. He hits me for real. And Sensei always welcomes me in a military way. :rolleyes:
My motivations are not anymore *proving*...ok, perhaps a little. I know that I can beat many men and women martial-artists if my determination and my will are strong. But the competition is not that thrilling anymore. Why compete when you can help others to become strong also? If there’s a moment that I really have to prove them wrong for a cause I believe in, I will. But why competing when that person is already proving it? Let them do it. Let them beat hell out of each other to win a competition.
However, I will still fight with my cousin but this time, not to prove him that I’m not weak but simply to become stronger mentally and physically thanks to him. I will fight only to survive and to protect my family.
I’m not saying I’m against in competition. I always find amusing to see women in a ring. If that woman goes vs man, I will support her instead of proving that I can beat her.
Hope with my experience, you understand some woman point of view(me) about her motivation to go on Martial-Art.
LP
Welcome to BudoSeek LadyPhoenix.
LadyPhoenix
11-29-2007, 14:33
Thank you Tony. :o
DragonMind
11-29-2007, 21:46
LadyPhoenix,
What you need is an equalizer to balance the scale between your cousin and you. Males have greater muscle mass and denser structure than females. Just a simple fact of biology. Learn how to use a stick and see if the outcome changes... :D
LadyPhoenix
12-08-2007, 21:33
LadyPhoenix,
What you need is an equalizer to balance the scale between your cousin and you. Males have greater muscle mass and denser structure than females. Just a simple fact of biology. Learn how to use a stick and see if the outcome changes... :D
I knew that a long time ago and I knew that I might beat him with weapons.
The only thing I didn't know that Sifu told me that you can gain skills by learning weapons.
I was sceptic at first...I was so thick headed that I focalised what I believed it's fair. Still, I won't use weapons against my cousin if he doesn't use weapons to fight me.
I don't know many knowledge about Martial-Arts...I couldn't stick longer in one school but I hope I would gain many new skills by learning how to use weapons.
Anyway, thank you to remind me about that. As in emotionally, I can find my balance but not really as in physically. I need to find another way since I'm a woman and I don't have the same denser structure than males.
Thank you Eliz, for the welcoming.
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