What Does a Black Belt Mean Today

**Chrono** · 12-11-2005, 10:43

All right, guys, I was watching Stuck on You a few days ago and if you've seen the movie the brothers are out with a couple of girls at a club and one gets in a confrontation with someone one of the girls know. One of the things she says stuck to me. "Be careful, he's got a black belt." After hearing that I couldn't help but think that doesn't really mean much anymore. I mean, anyone can get a black belt from Century and say they're a black belt. We've all seen or heard of schools that just give black belts away. Of course, in the movie he doesn't exactly exemplify anyone I'd imagine having a black belt.

What do y'all think? Does saying you have a black belt mean much today?

**Antares33** · 12-11-2005, 11:27

If anyone told me they were a black belt, I'd ask them in what? and learn a little more about the school and how long they trained before I really decided how legit it is. A black belt means what it means, but what really matters is the ability of the person.

**Jeff C.** · 12-11-2005, 18:55

Yes Jon, it means they are an idiot if they are going around telling people that.

Jeff Cook

**Musubi Dojo** · 12-11-2005, 20:22

Originally Posted by Jeff C.

Yes Jon, it means they are an idiot if they are going around telling people that.

Jeff Cook

**Nin** · 12-11-2005, 20:56

Most of "respectable" black belts aren't likely to be found in an "agressive" situation or to start a fight.
So I'd say I won't be impressed because there's 90% of chances the black belt agressor is poorly skilled (if not technically, mentally). Plus adding a lot of martial artists "showing off" outdoor aren't more than "dojo fighters".

But just my opinion.

Oh and except if he tells me he's a Ninja black belt!

**don** · 12-11-2005, 21:11

Originally Posted by Chrono

"Be careful, he's got a black belt." After hearing that I couldn't help but think that doesn't really mean much anymore....What do y'all think? Does saying you have a black belt mean much today?

Kano Jigoro began the belt system as a marketing device and it remains that today.

Knowledgeable folk I know never ask if you have a bb. They want to know who you trained with, for how long, and--if obvious--with what intensity.

**moogong** · 12-11-2005, 21:24

Originally Posted by Jeff C.

Yes Jon, it means they are an idiot if they are going around telling people that.

Jeff Cook

Agreed. Kinda like those people that have t-shirts that say they are a black belt, have the black belt keychain, and the black belt license plate frame. That just screams humility!!! I am pretty sure that goes along Jigaro Kano's original intention.

**TroyRoget** · 12-11-2005, 23:34

I was taught that you should keep the fact that you know martial arts almost secret. Basically, if you ask me I'll tell you I have a black belt, but I'll never volunteer the information.

**Cliff Hargrave** · 12-12-2005, 07:19

Originally Posted by moogong

Agreed. Kinda like those people that have t-shirts that say they are a black belt, have the black belt keychain, and the black belt license plate frame. That just screams humility!!! I am pretty sure that goes along Jigaro Kano's original intention.

A black belt is nothing more than a belt that goes around your waist. Being a black belt is a state of mind and attitude.

**Kat** · 12-12-2005, 08:00

theres someone in my class, she doesn't come regularly, but she's been doing it for 14 years now (and shes my age!!) and now got a black belt. When she graded she hasnt trained for weeks and if shes there she never seriously trains. Yet she tells everyone what to do. In former times I thought a black belt is very very hard to get, you need to train an enormous amount of time and be very very into your martial arts. Shes just telling everyone about her black belt and that shes been doing it for sooo long. I mean how intensive can you train when you are four,six, or even ten??? Isnt it at that stage just playing around?? Now I would rather ask how intensive someone has trained for say the last years. And I hate it when people go around and show off with what they can do or have done and give advice to anyone who doesnt want it. All those people try to do is constantly keep up their self image, I think this shouldnt be necessary if they come to training and show that they're good.

**Nyuck3x** · 12-12-2005, 11:30

I was taught privately for 10 years. There was never a need to wear
a colored belt until I started training with my Sensei's brother who
had a group near by. After the first class, I was asked by all the Sempai,
what rank I was. I told them to go talk to the head instructor's brother.
At the next class I was awarded a Shodan because, "the other students
might deveolp a complex".

All of the truely great teachers I have worked with never asked my rank.
I'm talking 5th through 10th Dan. I was always judged by what I knew
and could do.

Mr. Dave Lowery wrote a column in a recent BB magazine regarding this
topic. I suggest you might read it.

Kat,
I understand you might be looking for another school from another post.
FYI there's an organization you might want to stay away from. I was
informed of them by by mother-in-law in Limburgerhof, (an hour south
Frankfurt) and did some investigating. They're called Tako-ryu.
I contacted a couple of connections there and they told me that they
were shady at best. If you go to their web site, they don't even identify
any of their teachers.

Peace.

**Chrono** · 12-12-2005, 21:07

Originally Posted by TroyRoget

I was taught that you should keep the fact that you know martial arts almost secret. Basically, if you ask me I'll tell you I have a black belt, but I'll never volunteer the information.

I don't mind volunteering the information, though I don't make a huge deal out of it.

**Rich** · 12-12-2005, 21:15

It means nothing. I wish everyone just wore white belts. It would reduce the number of people who do MA for their own ego. Only people genuinely interested in the MA would train.

**lightninrod** · 12-12-2005, 22:48

A black belt nowadays means nothing. For many people it's bragging rights and nothing more. Really, my favorite thing for years was to hear from someone "I have a black belt in TKD!!!" (No offense to TKD folks. Although it's rare to see, I've been on the effective end of it.) Really, all that is anymore is a claim to fame. Better for learning purposes is someone who has a fairly low rank but has been at their art for a long time. They'll have more to teach you - by far.

Justin Mears

**TKDGURL** · 12-13-2005, 02:35

I think that a black belt means absolutly nothing...... to some one who did not put their blodd sweat and tears in to it. For some one who put their heart and soul into getting the belt well ten thats different

**jailess** · 12-13-2005, 06:12

This subject came up on the eBudo ShorinjiKempo forum a few days ago: Here is a link that has a lot of good things to say:

http://judoinfo.com/bb.htm

I'm getting my blackbelt this summer. It signifies that I have been training for 3 years and am serious about it. I can't really think of anything more it stands for. I don't even think that a Shodan in ShorinjiKempo can really teach anything to Brownbelts or good Bluebelts, to be honest: they're too close in skill level (UK Belt system: White, Yellow, Green, Blue, Brown, Black). If you've been training for 5-6 years (ie 2nd Dan) then you probably have something to teach, but not before.

As for fighting prowess? Depends on the person as well as the MA. Blackbelt Jame could kick Whitebelt Jame's arse, certainly. Outside that I couldn't really say.

Blackbelts mean training time and dedication. That's what they were intended to mean (if the above article is true) and that's what they should mean.

**Aaron T Fields** · 12-13-2005, 13:21

A black belt means the same thing it alwasy has, not much, except for to those in the same combative/combative sport as the originator of the ranks. Even then, it doesn't mean a lot. It has never been, nor ever will be standardized.

See judo history if you want to really get an idea of what it was intended for, public school PE class.

Aaron Fields
Seattle Jujutsu Club, Hatake Dojo
Sea-Town Sombo

www.seattle-jujutsu.org

**kenpo123** · 12-13-2005, 15:23

It means they earned there black belt in whatever style they studied. Pending on the school and the way they earned it varries from school to school and individual skill wouldnt ya say?

Most schools consider and teach that a black belt is really just knowing the basics well, and the real study of the particular martial art is to begin from then on.

Even then, its mostly dependant on the student, I have seen black belts and then I have seen BLACK BELTS. SO you cant really say much of a black belt only that prob he has put in anywhere from 4-6 years of study.

LIke anything else does 4-6 yrs mean much? It means you have some pratice thats all,,,,, UNLESS you are training 4-5 times a week in the dojo at home in your mind everyday and spend countless hours on the mat or whereever and are dedicated beyond beliefe and have natural skill and are in good shape can you say dam... THATS one HELL Of a black belt ..

**Erik** · 12-13-2005, 15:47

Ask them if they want a ribbon (or a chest to pin it on).

When I hear this nonsense I usually show them my black or brown leather belt holding up my pants and say in my most I-could-give-a-crap tone of voice, "Me too! I got a few more hanging up at home but this one matches my shoes today!"

**TroyRoget** · 12-13-2005, 21:04

I have a blackbelt, and I just had my butt handed to me in match against a TKD red belt. A black belt just means it's more embarassing when you lose. : )