Thread: Weapons begginer
03-29-2007, 13:20 #1
I am new to learning weapons and I was wondering if anyone had suggestions on how to get started. My school just made it a requirement for upper blackbelt levels, but I don't know how much time in class we will actually get to work on it. I'm primarily interested in practice weapons now, but I don't really know where to buy them or how to learn to use them. I was wondering if anyone could suggest a good place to purchase the actual weapon as well as an instructional book or video. I appreciate any suggestions you might have, and thank you for taking the time to read this.Wax on, wax off...missed a spot
03-29-2007, 19:35 #2
You didn't specify which weapon, so I'll suggest my own favorite: the cane.
I say this because a weapon you don't have with you is a pointless and useless weapon. You can carry the cane into a courtroom or onto a plane. The only drawback I have found is when teenagers insist, "Let me carry your pizza to your car for you, sir." I just let them.
The cane is wicked fast when swung by the crook. The horn (point of the crook) is a reverse-direction impact point unlike any other. I have taken a bit of the bo, and the hanbo and the jo. I never got half the speed and whoosh with a jo, no matter how I tried, as with the cane. After playing around with the cane for a year, I would prefer it to anything except a gun.
And I do have two handguns. But being as how they sit at home in a drawer, they are useless. I tote the bo and the hanbo around in my car. But I'd ignore them in an instant in favor of the cane. My jo stays leaning up against a corner of the entryway as I never really got to like it.
And unlike any bladed or piercing weapon, you can elect to moderate your use of the cane. You can bruise and batter without having to break. You just can't stab or slice someone "a little bit" as no jury will buy it. I once kept a vicious dog at bay quite easily with the cane all the while its owners were pleading with me not to kill their pet while it was busy trying to attack me. I managed not to do so and was never in the slightest danger as the dog could not get close without a good poke in the nose. Eventually a more commanding owner came along and leashed the beast. No cops, no paperwork, no lawsuit.
Were a pit bull to come for me I'd have both its front legs broken before it's teeth were within a yard of my tender flesh. I quite expect that if need be I could deal with a human just as easily even were they armed with a knife.
One piece of advice, though. Don't get the horn of your cane sharpened so that it looks like a weapon. Don't do anything fancy at all with it. Have them not put the CaneMaster's logo on it. Make it just as plain as can be, but out of solid hickory, good and heavy. That's all you need and it won't raise an eyebrow no matter where you tote it.
The cane isn't sexy, I'll admit. It's a workhorse, not a show horse.
Last edited by aplonis; 03-29-2007 at 19:40.
03-29-2007, 19:47 #3
My personal favourite is the sai. I'm not sure if they teach that in Korean weapon arts, and I have to admit that it won't be as easily accessible in daily life as a cane (so probably useless for self-defense, except for applying sai movements to other, more everyday type weapons).
But I love doing the sai kata because it uses a lot of movements similar to empty handed styles (karate/TKD), then at certain points, you get to flick it at your imaginary bad guy. So I guess what I love most about it is that it's a really sneaky weapon. It's also a short range weapon, and I personally prefer to fight close in karate sparring (I'm only 5'1 and usually end up sparring against people almost a foot taller than me), so in that way, the sai works for me as well.
There are a lot of sais available on eBay. I'm not sure about their quality, but they're pretty affordable, especially if you only need it for practice.Jaclyn Qua-Hiansen
03-29-2007, 22:02 #4
I have to admit I never really thought about the cane (though I've heard it's extremely useful), and I would love to learn the sai. I'd also like to learn the katana and the bo. Has anyone heard if one is better to start with than the other?Wax on, wax off...missed a spot
03-29-2007, 22:21 #5
I train with the bo now, and I've trained a bit with the bokken, which I guess would be similar to the katana.
No idea if this also applies to taekwondo, but in the karate schools I've seen at least, it seems more of them teach the bo than the katana, at least at the lower levels. At the very least, this may mean that there may be more people who can help you learn the bo than those who can help you learn the katana.
That being said, I found the bokken easier to learn and use, but that might just be because I learned only a super basic kata with it and I'm learning more complicated katas with the bo now.
Have you ever heard of the tekko? Not sure if it's available in North America, but it's basically like a horseshoe with spikes, and you put it on your hand to kinda form brass knuckles, I guess. Anyway, it's really easy to learn, because it's practically like doing the form empty handed, only difference is that you have spikes on your hands.
Oh and I personally found the nunchuks the hardest. I think the loss of control in using it just scared me.
Just a disclaimer, by the way, I'm only a green belt, so my opinions are nowhere near expert advice, just from my personal experience. Speaking of expert advice, it just hit me, did your teacher suggest any weapon in particular?Jaclyn Qua-Hiansen
03-29-2007, 22:28 #6
- Tony "Iron Hands" Urena
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Sword training are specifics to and art and/or country. For example each country may have it's sword training. Japanese have different styles relative to the sword like Iado or Iajutsu amongst others. While they may be taught in conjunction with empty art like Aikido, Aikijujutsu and some Jujutsu, they are not taught in conjunction with karate.
Nunchaku btw, not nunchuks, Sai, Tekko and Bo'sare all Okinawan, at least under those designations. Though Korean, Chinese, and other may train in their form of a staff.
Cane are found in Korean and Chinese arts. They are not usually found in Japanese of Okinawan arts, though one may learn it separately.
This by no means cover all the weapons of course."I don't lift, too heavy. I don't run, too far. I just hit people.
"The teacher is more important than the style."- Higa Yuchoku
03-29-2007, 23:01 #7
We do lots of katana training in aikido. My sensei also teaches iaido which i have been doing for a short while. Incredible, very intense training i feel like my forearms were going to fall off after the first 2 weeks now im use to it. My bo training has come along very nicely after 5 years (at first it was difficult) now its like tieing my shoes. I'm also begining qiquang (sp?) or the shaolin spear which is similair to a Bo but WAY MORE FUN(glad i started with bo it makes spear alot easier)!~Jon Bahey
03-30-2007, 21:02 #8
A disclaimer for your disclaimer Jaclyn: while you may only be a green belt you have had way more experience with weapons than I, and I'm a red belt. In my eyes that makes you someone worth talking to on the subject. Thanks for the info!Wax on, wax off...missed a spot
03-30-2007, 22:26 #9
Anytime, Adam! Good luck with weapons! They're a lot of fun!Jaclyn Qua-Hiansen
03-31-2007, 03:07 #10
Start with the most basic weapon, a stick. (joong bong in Korean, Jo in Japanese).
04-01-2007, 17:02 #11
Thank you everyone for your wonderful comments and advice. I now have a better idea of how to go about this next phase of my training. Thank you again.Wax on, wax off...missed a spot
04-03-2007, 17:58 #12
Just curious, Adam, have you decided which weapon to start with?Jaclyn Qua-Hiansen
04-07-2007, 13:05 #13
Not yet, probably whichever one I feel most comfortable with. Or whichever one I can actually get ahold of!Wax on, wax off...missed a spot
04-08-2007, 02:35 #14
What's so difficult about finding a stick??
04-08-2007, 10:31 #15
You know, I tried to think of something to say to that; something witty or maybe even proffessional sounding, but I can't! I guess in truth I just haven't gone out to find one yet. Martial arts supply in my area is next to none though, and I'm currently waiting on a supply catalog to arrive by mail. I guess while I'm waiting I could just go get a wooden broom handle and go with that maybe?Wax on, wax off...missed a spot
04-08-2007, 11:14 #16
Sounds like a good idea.
04-10-2007, 14:45 #17
Starting with a dan bong, or even longer sticks is a good start.
Also, I really like the cane. Usually in Hapkido you don't start learning cane until black belt ranks, but I teach all of my students the cane, they just don't have to be tested on cane techniques until they are in their black belt ranks.
I like the cane because, as already posted, it can be a very practical weapon. In the programs I teach, there are basic very practical and useful techniques as well as the fancier Hapkido cane techniques. All are fun to learn and practice and can help with your martial art and self-defense skills. I find when I do seminars, people really like learning the cane material. I'll be heading off to Boise, ID this weekend with my bag of canes. :-)
A good cane program, in my opinion, includes how to block, strike, poke, and thrust with the cane as well as various defenses with the cane to combat different grabs and attacks. This will include joint locks and throws with the cane as well. (However, just like with empty hand techniques, striking and thrusting with the cane is much easier than joint locking and throwing.)
Canemasters has some good canes, but I caution you with carrying a cane that has been modified too much to be a weapon. You may face some legal trouble by doing so. I also have a nice little scar on my arm from a guy at a seminar who brought a canemasters cane that was sharpened and used it to train. I wasn't too happy with him, and he still appologizes when I see him at seminars. If you know how to use it, a regular cane will work just fine in defending yourself.
Shameless plug - I have seen most of the instructional cane videos out there, and I honestly believe my cane dvd with Paladin Press will far surpass them in providing instruction on how to use the cane for self-defense. It will be out in July and if you wait till then you'll be able to check it out and read reviews.
As for products available right now: TRS had a cane tape with Ray Ellingston, Kelly Worden, and Jerry Van Cook. It is a bit expensive, but a good program. The stuff Ray teaches is a lot like what I teach with the cane with a crook at the end. Kelly's stuff is a bit more FMA style since that is his back ground. One of the better cane resources. Cold Steel has a cane program that is pretty good. There is very little in that program with the cane with a crook, it is more the walking stick type cane that Cold Steel sells. The instruction is good and quite a bit different from what I teach as well. It is a bit expensive too, and I'd recommend checking out e-bay or when they have a sale. (I don't know what Paladin will price my dvd at, but it most likely will be more than one dvd since we filmed a lot, it might be higher priced too, but I'm sure it won't be as high as TRS and Cold Steel)
Turtle Press released a cane dvd last year that is reasonably priced for an hour dvd. I have not seen it yet, so I can't comment on what it teaches, etc.
There are some more traditional cane instruction videos out there and a book by GM Myung, as well as a few techniques taught in other HKD books or dvds. Often these just show a half dozen or so cane techniques in a larger HKD program.
Above all, enjoy incorporating weapons into your training and continue along the path...
04-10-2007, 14:56 #18
Originally Posted by Adam
No seriously, there's great advice here. A stick/ broom handle / rolling pin / souviner bat (i can't spell french) is a good place to start.
Have you spoken to your teacher about it? Do they recommened anything in particular? is there a curriculum?
Like everyone else said, it's really just making your hand(s) longer... so at first weapons training is about re-learning all your basics. (in my admittedly limited experience). In terms of real practicality, a cane is great, strictly for training, a staff is a common first weapon, probably because it involves both hands and is relatively heavy to strengthen the wrists.
all the best!Bill De Franza