Is TKD really no good in a "real" fight?

[DragonMind]

Goshin or modern Japanese Jujutsu is where its at for self defense. You can throw away all other martial arts IMO. Goshin JJJ covers every single aspect of a fight from stand up, take down and throws, ground work, multiple attackers, weapons. You name it Goshin JJJ covers it.
IMO its simply the most all round effective martial art, modern arts like Krav Maga or Goshin JJJ are goods for self defense .

Really? Must be some really good crack you're smoking. And what arts do you have ANY experience in that you feel qualified to compare the breadth and depth of the significant multitude of arts?

[Adam G]

Woah, very polite post there buddy.
Yeah i been round but i don't have to justify myself to such a rude presumptuous thing like you now do i?

Notice the IMO, or am i not allowed one?

[Prince Loeffler]

Woah, very polite post there buddy.
Yeah i been round but i don't have to justify myself to such a rude presumptuous thing like you now do i?

Notice the IMO, or am i not allowed one?

You're truly entitled to state your own personal opinion. To re-state Dragonmind's inquiry regarding your martial arts experiences and background:

what arts do you have ANY experience in that you feel qualified to compare the breadth and depth of the significant multitude of arts?


I've always wanted to learn more about martial arts from experienced individual in this community.

Thank you and awaiting your professional summation on why Goshin JJJ is an art worthy above all.

[Adam G]

No worries.
Currently training Goshin jujitsu, Orange belt.
Judo up to orange belt.
Karate up to green.
Muay Thai for almost a year and a half.
10 years of High contact Rugby union and league.
Year of Universal self defense ( TKD ) .
Body board / surf almost everyday.
Grew up on the street, was stupid and messed round with street gangs.
Mother was murdered , stabbed to death.
Many friends also not with us anymore.
Ive been cut, jumped and shot at.
Seen that much violence in my life its a crime.

After all of that, my thinking on Goshin Jujitsu is this.. It covers every aspect of a fight , and does so in the most efficient and controlled way possible.

I didn't say it was worthy above all.. I said it was the best martial art for self defense. Now if you wanna harness you Chi, maybe you would do Tai Chi, Sport, maybe judo BJJ or TKD.. For pure self defense IMO Goshin Jujitsu or maybe Krav maga is what ya want.

Just my opinion , but you no what they say about opinions.
There like an arse hole, everyone's got one.

[Eliz]

Yeah i been round but i don't have to justify myself to such a rude presumptuous thing like you now do i?

If you take the time to look through some of Barry's (Dragonmind) posts, you will find that he is not in the least bit rude - he is experienced and to the point. Many of us here value his input and experience.

The owner of this website very carefully picks and screens all of his moderators.

After all of that, my thinking on Goshin Jujitsu is this.. It covers every aspect of a fight , and does so in the most efficient and controlled way possible.

I think you will find many members here who are passionate about their primary style. The difference therein being, we rarely tout our primary practice as the big "it" [as you have done]. Experience has taught us that the effectiveness of a style is proven in the hands of the practitioner - something many non Goshin JJ practioners do daily.

I didn't say it was worthy above all..

Your earlier post said exactly that ....

You can throw away all other martial arts IMO.

..............................

I said it was the best martial art for self defense.

Grab a set of sticks and go play with Barry (Dragonmind) for a while. You may find your opinion somewhat changed

Just my opinion , but you no what they say about opinions.
There like an arse hole, everyone's got one.

Well that was very eloquently phrased. Thank you for that

[Adam G]

Goshin or modern Japanese Jujutsu is where its at for self defense. You can throw away all other martial arts IMO.

Quote the whole thing next time....

If you think implying im a crack smoker is not rude, then we have different view on the meaning of rude...............

As i said in earlier post, Goshin JJJ take much from many arts, and put them into a compete system . You presume i think at other martial arts have no value, this is not the case.
What im saying is IMO, Goshin Jujitsu is the most compete MA for self defense, there's a reason cops come to us for pin holds,and arresting techniques, there's a reason it was taught to our soldiers in WW2. .Its called the grandfather of Japanese martial arts ,its been round the block a few times.

I understand what your saying about the practioners and their martial arts. But answer me this.
If you get people of the same size strength, reach and so on.
Does the art then come into play?
There are more efficient arts than others, lets not kid ourselves.

I love all martial arts and take as much as i can from all of them.
What i meant by"you can throw away other arts" is, if all you could train was one martial art in the world, it would be Goshin Jujitsu, We get to do everything anyways so ya wouldn't miss out on much .

[Adam G]

Grab a set of sticks and go play with Barry (Dragonmind) for a while. You may find your opinion somewhat changed

Thats Just the thing isnt it .... Id have to go grab a pair of sticks, because usually(like most people) i don't walk around the street with 2 sticks......

[jjaje]

Notice the IMO, or am i not allowed one?

Rule #10

10. Do not use Instant Messenger slang or shorthand to make your posts. Posts should be typed in clear and concise language, with the aim of using correct spelling and punctuation in order to best facilitate communication with your fellow members.

Adding the IMO at the end of

You can throw away all other martial arts

doesn't change the sentence, or make the intent or impact any different. It is just as bad as insulting someone, then adding the little smiley face at the end of the insult, it's still an insult.

So let's do an experiment, which sounds better
"Goshin or modern Japanese Jujutsu is where its at for self defense. You can throw away all other martial arts" coming from a very low ranking person in a few martial arts

or

"Although I'm new, when investigating systems, Goshin JJ impressed me the most as being well rounded for personal safety."

And my last rant, honest.

modern arts like Krav Maga or Goshin JJJ are goods for self defense .

And what is it with people's affection to automatically recommend Krav Maga? Seems like some people are being certified in weekend seminars to teach some versions of Krav Maga. Why do people who haven't ever trained in it (as you didn't list it in your training) automatically speak so highly of it? Is it just based on the magazine articles and marketing? Like all styles, there are very good Krav Maga schools, and there are some that are not as good.

[DragonMind]

My point was that despite your obvious enthusiasm for the art you study, you do not have the experience with other arts to make a valid comparison. I spent more than 35 years in Korean systems and more than a decade in Arnis and have a pretty fair idea of exactly what is in them.

I still learn things from my Japanese and Chinese and Filipino friends about their systems all of the time. The best I can say is "here is how we approach that concept/topic/idea". We compare notes and try to examine perceived weaknesses or gaps in what we see in each other's systems. Almost without fail, assuming the system or style is legitimate, what I or others saw as a deficiency was actually a lack of sufficiently deep understanding of that other art. For example, your list of things covered by Goshin JJ are equally well covered in Hapkido and Arnis. The key to misunderstanding though is the particular emphasis of the school or instructor that you may have observed. For example, if you watched my Arnis teacher/friend/mentor, Dan Anderson, for a few days you would likely come to the conclusion that he is a "stick man". Same for my Modular Blade and FCS instructors, Bram Frank and Ray Dionaldo; you'd think they are only "blade guys". I have taken a stick spanking from both Bram and Ray, and I've seen Dan go hell on wheels with blades. I assure you, these gentlemen are quite competent in areas you may not see often.

As for the smoking crack comment, I had noticed that you listed your age at 32. Such an ignorant statement as yours is generally excused in our teen-age members as simply a sign of the hopefully temporary condition of being young and stupid. Amazing how often those two go together... Anyways, given your age I felt I should give you the benefit of the doubt and attribute the stupid part to the influence of a mind-altering substance. Now that I see the actual significant lack of experience you do have outside your own mind, I suppose I shall have to ignore your chronological age and take your comments as if coming from a teenager.

By the way, one area of my Filipino training is called Latigo y Daga which translates to Whip and Blade. In fact, we cover many systematic approaches to weapons combinations (e.g. Espada y Daga, Baston y Daga, Doble Baston, Sarong y Daga) to examine not just how a single weapon is used but how multiple weapons of varying ranges/tactics/techniques are used in unison. How much experience do you have with that in your Goshin JJ? I've named it, do you cover it?

[kbarrett]

Adam, while I repsect your opinion and feelings about your MA, I also have to agree with what's already been said, everybody here on Budoseek can say the same thing about their MA and it's been mentioned more than once here all over Budoseek, it's not the MA it's the perosn studing that MA that makes it work.

Sincerely
Ken Barrett

[Abbax8]

No worries.
Currently training Goshin jujitsu, Orange belt.

How long does it take to get to Orange Belt in GJJ

Judo up to orange belt.

Which mean you have 1 to 2 years of judo. This means you do not know judo but are familiar with some judo techniques

Karate up to green.

See above reply to Judo

Muay Thai for almost a year and a half.

See above reply for judo and karate

10 years of High contact Rugby union and league.
Year of Universal self defense ( TKD ) .
Body board / surf almost everyday.
Grew up on the street, was stupid and messed round with street gangs.
Mother was murdered , stabbed to death.
Many friends also not with us anymore.
Ive been cut, jumped and shot at.
Seen that much violence in my life its a crime.

Sorry for mother. Being stupid and messing with street gangs may teach you be tough but does not give you insight into the intricasies of the various MA's.
Rugby is tough but not really pertinent to the discussion neither is surfing or boby boarding.

After all of that, my thinking on Goshin Jujitsu is this.. It covers every aspect of a fight , and does so in the most efficient and controlled way possible.

I didn't say it was worthy above all.. I said it was the best martial art for self defense. Now if you wanna harness you Chi, maybe you would do Tai Chi, Sport, maybe judo BJJ or TKD.. For pure self defense IMO Goshin Jujitsu or maybe Krav maga is what ya want.

Sport - Judo. What was the nature of your judo training? For competition? For self defense? For fitness? For the pure study of judo?

Just my opinion , but you no what they say about opinions.
There like an arse hole, everyone's got one.

And some opinions are less informed than others. I recommend you practice a bit of restraint in your posts. There are members here who have trained in one art longer than you have been alive. They will readily tell you they are still learning the basics of their art. From your post you have not been involved in any art for an appreciable period of time to make such a sweeping statement.

Welcome to BudoSeek!

Dennis

[Cliff Hargrave]

How come every wanna be tough guy grew up "on the streets" around gangs?

I grew up in a quiet little sub-division, was in high school sports, scouting, made good grades, and went to church on Sundays....

[Adam G]

My point was that despite your obvious enthusiasm for the art you study, you do not have the experience with other arts to make a valid comparison. I spent more than 35 years in Korean systems and more than a decade in Arnis and have a pretty fair idea of exactly what is in them.

I still learn things from my Japanese and Chinese and Filipino friends about their systems all of the time. The best I can say is "here is how we approach that concept/topic/idea". We compare notes and try to examine perceived weaknesses or gaps in what we see in each other's systems. Almost without fail, assuming the system or style is legitimate, what I or others saw as a deficiency was actually a lack of sufficiently deep understanding of that other art. For example, your list of things covered by Goshin JJ are equally well covered in Hapkido and Arnis. The key to misunderstanding though is the particular emphasis of the school or instructor that you may have observed. For example, if you watched my Arnis teacher/friend/mentor, Dan Anderson, for a few days you would likely come to the conclusion that he is a "stick man". Same for my Modular Blade and FCS instructors, Bram Frank and Ray Dionaldo; you'd think they are only "blade guys". I have taken a stick spanking from both Bram and Ray, and I've seen Dan go hell on wheels with blades. I assure you, these gentlemen are quite competent in areas you may not see often.

As for the smoking crack comment, I had noticed that you listed your age at 32. Such an ignorant statement as yours is generally excused in our teen-age members as simply a sign of the hopefully temporary condition of being young and stupid. Amazing how often those two go together... Anyways, given your age I felt I should give you the benefit of the doubt and attribute the stupid part to the influence of a mind-altering substance. Now that I see the actual significant lack of experience you do have outside your own mind, I suppose I shall have to ignore your chronological age and take your comments as if coming from a teenager.

By the way, one area of my Filipino training is called Latigo y Daga which translates to Whip and Blade. In fact, we cover many systematic approaches to weapons combinations (e.g. Espada y Daga, Baston y Daga, Doble Baston, Sarong y Daga) to examine not just how a single weapon is used but how multiple weapons of varying ranges/tactics/techniques are used in unison. How much experience do you have with that in your Goshin JJ? I've named it, do you cover it?

Once again , very polite post there buddy..

Yea we have stick and blade techniques, but i wont start talking Japanese to make myself look good.
We have jo, sword, knife, bat/stick and gun techniques. Like i said, were a self defense art, we dont attack, we learn to receive and counter , or attack only with no other option.

Well ive been called Arrogant, a crack head, a teenager,Uniformed and tough guy, young and stupid.
Seems like im not the only one with issues on this site.. i may fit in yet

[Adam G]

Ok, sorry for being so pig headed. .

Im not saying im tough or hard cause i was in a gang guy's. What i meant by that is I've seen more violence than the average person, way more. So i have a pretty good understanding of what would work and what wouldn't.

Thanks for making the last 10 years of my martial arts training feel worthless.

Its taking me just over 2 years to progress to orange belt(and that's fast).

The Ive done Judo in two different time's, One was as a child at about the age of 5, got to orange.
The next was to help our take downs and pins for Rugby.

Surfing is great training for Martial arts. You have to make split seconds decisions and in many cases can be life or death.With almost every sport or martial arts its you that pushes the pace.. In the water your at the mercy of the sea and must deal with what ever is thrown your way, in split seconds. You cant panic, you drown. You gotta be mentally and psychically strong.

Man i feel like in under the media watch press with you guys quoting snippets of info ive posted to make me look bad... i meant for self defense..

[Erik]

The owner of this website very carefully picks and screens all of his moderators.

He slips up every now and then... he let me in.

I'm with Adam when he cites Rugby and surfing, as crazy as that sounds. He's right about the split second decisions in the midst of chaos and lots of sensory inputs. When I was bouncing I think the water polo helped as much as anything else.

But Adam, you'll get more mileage out of your argumentation if you express it like "I've done this and it seemed to work well for me here and this is why I think it did" as opposed using phrases like "best possible" or "most (anything)".

[moogong]

I think this thread has run it's course. Adam G might really Ali G pranking us with a moronic post but I can't prove it. The original question is if TKD works in a real fight and that has been covered many times over.

Thread closed.