Sin Moo's Multiple 10th Dans

[Michael Tomlinson]

I think anyone trained in ballet would have some fantastic kicks once they learned the movements...I have nothing but respect for anyone who trains in ballet...ok...don't laugh folks but in high school I actually took ballet for a short while to help me with extra agility training while playing middle linebacker on our football team...NO I did not wear any of the clothes...although if they would of had some tight purple spandex back then I would of at least tried it on just to see how it felt against my body......ok since you all are close to puking in your mouth on that one.... just let me state that ballet training ain't no joke...it was unbelievably hard and actually much harder than martial arts training in my opinion...it did help me with my agility....I had 170 tackles in 10 games and led all of southwest Ohio..including the Cincinnatti and Dayton Ohio areas in tackles that year...Hahhh...so yep it helped...I also think real deal Yoga training also helps...which I have been into since about 1972 or so...I'm sorry but I'm still not convinced on the hip structure thing...BUT...my first Korean instructor way back in 1970 used to yell at us while stretching "you Americans need to throw your couch and chairs away and sit on floor" "too much furniture and not enough stretching!!!" and he was right then and now....

alright enough babbling...I'm gonna go look for some purple spandex and a half dozen circus midgets...you all can fill in the blanks!!
Michael Tomlinson

[wael]

Back to the original question, I think a relevant question might be, how much of a promotion fee did those three masters have to pay?

I don't mean to imply that the masters who were promoted were unqualified, or that they bought their promotions, not at all. I trained under Master Jung for a while and he's brilliant.

But we tend to ascribe noble intentions and advanced characters to martial arts masters, while for many of them it's a business, and it's not unusual for them to do things for mercenary reasons, just like any other business owner.

[mateo]

The lack of a 10th dan thing comes from Gen. Choi Hong Hi, as he believed that 10th dan equalled perfection as so was unattainable. It was applied to taekwondo but really represented the general's ideas and so is not applicable to other Korean martial arts. I'm not sure of the WTF still ascribes to this notion.

It seems that some people believe that 10th dan is reserved for the founder of an art or the current headmaster but this is not historically the case.

Lots of martial arts have had multiple 10th dans including judo, the martial art which introduced the kyu-dan system to martial arts from the more traditional menkyo licencing system. Indeed, Kano was not a 10th dan because as the Founder he was seen as being outside the grading system. there were multiple 10th dan holders in judo although the Kodokan has been very conservative about using the grade for the past decade or so.

10th dan is supposed to represent a level of technical proficiency in the art which practitioners of the art can aspire to and a lifelong commitment to the promotion of the art. we would asume that a 10th dan would also have leadership skills to help the art move in a positive direction.

While a 10th dan does not necessarily indicate the founder of the art, I think it would be strange to achieve this grading before one had reached an advanced and had made significant sustained efforts to the promotion of the art.

I think that Master Ji has recognized a need to indicate the people he believes should shape the future direction of his art and by doing so during his life perhaps he will have helped Sin Moo avoid a power struggle within his art after he passes. Time will tell.

[rainesr]

I asked questions about 10th Dan when I took TSD and also was given the Gen. Choi Hong Hi story, but also told you only get 10th Dan when you die (very provocative). I know very little about Ji Han Jae / Sin Moo or if the promotions are appropriate or not, but it seems odd to me to have 20 ranks in the Dan system and only use some of them.

A 10th Dan is just someone who knows more of a lineage/style than a 9th Dan in the same lineage/style and so on. If someone qualifies or earns a rank give it to them, 10th Dan or not.

This is probably just my brash American way of thinking poking through.