05-10-2011, 05:53 #21
Well I can't answer that one either.
First brute force isn't everything. Neither is just being a technique jocky. It's about being effect (martial) and knowing what you are doing and continuing the tradition and art. Understand what you are doing.
But I guess there is no answer. However 4 shodans in four different styles.....i think that's a bit much at that age at least. Reminds me of the old saying "Jack of all trades and master of none". More often than not I'm still learning stuff out of basics or beginner kata's and I've been doing karate for 18 years.
But I guess what you are saying is
"What's in a name? That which we call a rose
By any other name would smell as sweet". - William Shakespear
"What's in a dan? Would those who are masters be less effective by a lesser dan or those who are beginners more effective with it?" - Potentpoefie
I guess the way I feel (and I sense Jim as well) is that it should mean something.Lin Meiring
The more I learn the less I know.
05-10-2011, 12:08 #22
Rank is a relationship between you and your teacher. No one else...
The only person rank is really an issue for is the instructor.
Sensei is the only one who needs to know why a person has rank.
It is based on their relationship as well as knowledge and ability.
Westerners’ do not understand the practice of a "Do" art because it is not part of our
culture. "Do" arts do not focus on ability but on devotion. Kyudo (Japanese archery)
does not even care if they hit the target. It is the perfection of form.
Borrowed from: http://www.shiseiryu.com/originsofju...dingsystem.htm
Kyu / Dan Grade System
The majority of people believe that Jigoro Kano was the founder the Kyu / Dan grade system, this is untrue. However, he is recognized as the first person to use this grading system within the Martial Arts. The idea of the Kyu / Dan grade system, or Dan-I, was in fact “borrowed” from other sources of Japanese culture.
The Kyu / Dan system was first introduced in the 17th century by Honinbo Dosaku, a grandmaster of the Japanese 2 player logical board game “Go”. He introduced the system, as a method of handicapping the game. Honinbo itself, was the name of one of the four famous major schools of “Go” in Japan, the head of the school was given the schools title.
Later the Japanese public schools were using the Kyu / Dan system as a means to rank ability throughout the different athletic departments. These departments were using belts or ribbons to identify ranking ability, most notably within swimming, where advanced swimmers wore a black ribbon around their waist to separate them from beginners in swimming tournaments.
Many other areas of Japanese culture had also adopted this system, i.e. Chado (Tea Ceremony), Ikebana (Flower Arranging), Shogi (Japanese Chess), Renju (Connect Five), Calligraphy, to name just a few, etc, etc.
Now, to be an advanced swimmer does not mean they have to be a champion swimmer. No,
just one that knows how to do the strokes. Is there a difference in the taste of the tea between an intermediate and advanced chado-ka?
Here in the West, the mysterious Black Belt means you can do all kinds of superhuman things. Kids "Graduate" from Kindergarten, Middle school, High school and College. We are
always having to start over in one thing or another. In a way, it gives us all something to look
This is why I believe kids’ ranks can be a good thing. If people saw a kid with a high kid's rank, then there would be justification and you would not bat an eye but, to compare it to an adult
rank would be ridiculous.
Many of the Masters were Menkyo holders at an early age.
Student of Stooge-Ryu
Master of Flung Poo
"Love many, trust few and do wrong to none". -Chan Yau-man - Survivor Fiji Finalist
05-11-2011, 06:01 #23
- Russ Ebert
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That's a good post Ray. I have to say there are a lot of good points in it too. The "dan" ranking is truly a "game rank", while things like "soke" were reserved for merchants and artisans. To be honest, if you were to measure a bushi in the 18th century, you would measure his Koku and his "viscountcy" with his daimyo. That's the real way of things! How much land they had and how many people they could feed with it was an indication of how powerful they were. Then again, it usually had little to do with how good their fighting skills were....unless we are talking before Edo, then it was everything goes.Russ Ebert
The narcissism of small differences is especially true in the martial arts.
05-19-2011, 12:54 #24
She's a nice kid, but I wouldn't award her a Black Belt and she's not ready to teach.