London 2012 (long read)

[coralreefer]

After reading some articles on the London 2012 site concerning the upcoming Olympic games, I wanted to, what may best be described as venting and lamenting on my opinions and predictions of the upcoming games.

As many of us are aware, over the past few years there have been several changes to the rules of WTF Taekwondo tournaments in major events. Some of these rule changes have proved mildly positive, while others have shown themselves to be (in my opinion) detrimental to the sport in regards to competition.

One in particular that bothers me greatly is the notion that at this Olympic games, head kicks will be scored even if only a tiny portion of the foot makes contact with the head...regardless of the power behind the kick. The reasoning behind this is severalfold, with competitor safety being at the top of that list. Also which was the case much longer ago when it was decided that head kicks would score multiple points, and spinning/jumping kicks would score even more, that increasing the action of the game by giving greater incentive to attempt head kicks would lead to increased excitement of the match, and thereby make the sport more attractive and interesting to fans and spectators.

While all of that sounds great in theory, I am of the opinion that the latter reason stated above with turn into a complete backfire and actually work to do the exact opposite of what the governing body hopes to do in its attempt to draw more fans and make matches more exciting.

I say this because of my own personal experiences last year at the World Taekwondo Championships held in Gyungju, S. Korea last year.

Before I go on, let me preface the following comments by saying that as many of the regulars here may remember, I came to Korea in 2004 for Taekwondo training, and have been here ever since. I am not only a practitioner and semi-retired competitor myself, but also one of those people who would follow the sport and watch events regardless of recent rule changes.

Although I was never considered elite, or even close to elite, I had this kind of expectation that at the international level of competition, rules would be administered in a much different way than they were back when I was competing heavily between 2000 - 2005.

With all of that aside, you can imagine my glee when I learned that the 2011 World Championships were being held in Korea, in a city that was literally only a 45 minute drive from my home. During that week, I skipped all my classes (Im a graduate student in Korea these days) joined twitter just so I could hob-nob and interact with US team members competing (and wow, they actually responded to my tweets, acknowledged me, spoke with me at the events, etc) and pretty much lived the life of a groupie during that competition.


During that week of watching competitions from morning till evening, aside from all of the autograph hunting and chit-chatting I did, I noticed many things that bothered me greatly, and many that even to a dedicated fan like myself, made my overall impression of the event lackluster.


First, while I wont criticize the electronic scoring system, that event was my first chance to see live the system in action. As a former competitor myself, I was especially interested in this. During the matches over those several days, I witnessed more than several occasions where a body kick was registered and scored with a kick that at least seemed from the stands (front row was about 20 feet to the center of the corner mats) to be VERY light, while other kicks that could actually be heard over all of the fans, chanting, drumbeats, etc..would not register at all.

Naturally since sensors are spaced in certain patterns, a kick directly over the sensor with light contact may score while one a few inches away from a sensor may need more power...with this in mind I chalked it up to design, and decided to get some info on my own.

So one morning I went to the venue well before competition began, mostly because I wanted to get my flags and drum set up in the front row, and partly because each morning they have helpers out on the mats setting up for the days competition, part of which included bringing out each and every hogu worn my competitors, and testing it with the electronic system. During that session, I watched young ladies put each one on the mats (a surface that doesn't move unlike a person in a match..which would lead one to conclude that points should register easily)) and proceed to punch it over and over until it registered points several times. In some occasions, the points would register fairly easily, but on others, I watched girls punch a target 10 or more times before it would finally register a point...leading me to believe that although electronic scoring in principle is likely an evolution that has to happen, the current system, sensitivity, and randomness of this or that hogu, and this or that side of the hogu leave much to be desired. (I actually have video of this "hogu testing" on my facebook page


But what disturbed me the most was the head shot rules, and the instant reply options. While we can probably all agree that player safety is a worthy issue, as mentioned previously these rule changes seem to detract from the sport more than anything else.

Rather than write more paragraphs, I will list my aversion and their side effects in list order.

1. (And this one has bothered me long before 2011, and not related to any recent rule change) - The fact that head shots are scored the same regardless of whether or not the player throwing the kick can actually maintain balance.

Although it is not new to throw hail mary kicks in hopes of landing one, during those events I noticed what seemed more like a strategy of players to throw such kicks with no hope or expectation of landing them...knowing full well that they will either land the kick or in nearly all cases fall to the mat, thereby forcing the referee to back up the other player, giving the down player a 5-6 second break to collect their thoughts, take a short breather, adjust their strategy, and run time off the clock.

2. While it seemed to me in that event that the headshot rule (slightest head contact wins points)..what this led to was many players adopting what i would call an ITF style of play...where they would simply chamber a leg...hop across the ring with the leg chambered, throw a flick of a kick toward the head, and then immediately fall to the mat as above,(no offense to the ITF people out there intended) and again as above stop the fight, waste more time, etc etc.

One of my strong contentions with this was a match I saw between in Israeli player, and a French player in which the French player spent most of the match being dominated, running, etc, and toward the end of the 3rd round the score was 5-1, but literally in the last 10 seconds the French player came forward with some wild, hail mary combos that were sloppy, but just barely grazing the headgear on two occasions, and ended the match with a score of 7-5. It was one of the most heart-breaking moments I can ever recall..watching that Isreali player fall to his knees, hands covering his tears knowing that even though he had CLEARLY been the better of the two fighters overall, his Olympic dream was lost in 10 seconds to kicks that could best be described as gusts of wind.

3. As we saw in the previous Olympics in a case with I believe a Chinese and Aussie player, the instant replay system was in use, and coaches were more than happy to use the rule. In principle that is fine and I frankly find it fair in competitions such as this where a match can determine either making an Olympic team, or otherwise advancing to the next round in major tournaments and medals such as the Olympics. However although I agree with the system, it is just another cog in the machine that I believe will doom the sport.

Why?

Because all of these rule changes meant to not only make a match more fair, but also more exciting for the viewer (other rules not mentioned include smaller competition area, penalty for 10 seconds of inactivity, etc) make a 9 minute match into what was averaging to be an 18 minute affair. Seriously, between all of the falling on the mat by competitors, replays by both sides, and rest periods between rounds, matches dragged on for so long that whatever excitement might have been created by rule changes was offset by the same rule changes, or otherwise strategies of players to win within the rule changes, which brings us back to where the style of play was at in the beginning, only now there it is so much more complicated, and as many have said, drags itself even farther from being the "martial art" of old.

So here is my wishlist. If I were someone important in the world of Taekwondo and could make exectutive decisions concerning competition, here is the way I would like to see things done.

1. If headshots cannot be scored electronically and evenly, then there should be no electronic system at all. Makes no sense to me to have electronic scoring chest protectors to hopefully score accurately while the current rules incite players to attempt more headshots which are still scored by live judged and in contention by review.

2. Similar to 1, headshots should not be scored at all if they do not cause some type of "disturbance" to the opposing player. Back when I first began competing, a body shot would not supposed to be scored unless it caused "trembling shock" to the opposing player..in that it had to visually move or otherwise disturb the opponent. I believe the same should be true of head shots...in that a headshot should not count as a point at all if it doesn't either move the head, turn the face, or otherwise cause an opponent to squint, look away, close their eyes..in short...disturb their concentration/balance or action.

3. In the same vein with headshots, if the player throwing the kick cannot remain on their feet after the kick (except in the case where they are pushed off balance by significant body contact) then the kick should only count for 1 point rather than 3-4 points. (and even then, in my world even just one point is generous) In London spinning hook kicks that make even the slightest head contact will score 4 points even though only a centimeter of toe surface may make contact, and the kicker falls flat on their ass after the kick. To me, that is just not right, defeats the purpose of sparring at all, and is a great incentive to take an underhanded way to a victory. In short, a technique should only be scored if it is a "completed" technique...that being one that begins and ends from a stable defensible position.

Sorry for the long rant. Just needed to get these things off my chest.

[Webmaster]

Vent away. I think most folks would be in agreement with you. Seems that the constant tinkering with the rules in TKD is no different than the constant tinkering with the rules in Judo. It's not good for either sport!

[Tripitaka of AA]

That rant actually made me want to watch the TKD at the Olympics. I think you described it very clearly and I think I would support your point of view.. now I just want to see it for myself. Thanks for the vent.

[Eliz]

I am not part of the electronic scoring generation and I have not stayed current with it. I am only semi-active these days and the group I am with is pretty grass roots.

That being said, I did a quick search. Is this the YouTube link you referenced?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8hLLYgkflG8

As per the video, his kicks are spot on and the system is inconsistant at best.

As for the rules and all of the game playing by the competitors: back when I was more active there were a bunch of subjective rulings that were rarely enforced. Rules governing intentional falls, excessive force, control and so forth. Clearly it sounds from your post that the rules are becoming even more subjective. That is disappointing to me.

When I went into semi-retirement they were just discussing the wrap-around kick vs. a kick to the back. The determining factor being whether the toes crossed the backbone or the bridge of the foot did ..... [rolls eyes] I had had enough at that point.

[coralreefer]

Hello Eliz. Good to see you are still around on this board.

As far as the video I mentioned, it was not a youtube video, but rather one that I shot myself at the tournament. I made the video public on my facebook page, so if you are interested to see it..here is the link - https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=211575988860135

Although the video only shows a few seconds of the "testing" I was referring to, I spent a good 20 minutes watching, matching colored hogu in this or that ring being punched while watching the scoreboard of that ring. Although these girls (nearly all of these assistants were females of various taekwondo/sports education departments at various universities in Korea) were not packing the same kind of power with their punches as a full on kick, it was rather obvious to me that in many cases a strike on a target against the floor would sometimes register and sometimes not.

As far as the rule changes, the article I read concerning rules in London that got me so riled up/disappointed is here - http://www.metro.co.uk/olympics/8953...-2012-olympics

[gmtkd]

Thanks for writing this post. I spend most of my life doing the modern sport of taekwondo, and think it's the best sport in the world (since it's the only sport I play, I'm biased I admit). But, I coach and play at such a low level that I don't need to worry about electronic chest gear or other top level rule changes.
I'm glad I don't need to worry about these things but I hope that the people who do listen to good opinions such as yours.

[coralreefer]

Anyone interested in watching the live matches today, please see the following link: http://www.stopstream.tv/43/41/434181.html

So far this stream has been great (I'm three hours in), and commentary is in English.

Note; If the channel stops, reload the page. If that doesnt work, go back to the stopstream.tv homepage, find the taekwondo, and reload from there, or otherwise choose another video option.

[Tripitaka of AA]

Perhaps you need to be in UK for this link, but here is the BBC feed page for today's live event.

[coralreefer]

Here is the link for the afternoon session (quarterfinals and semis) that begins in just over an hour.

Updated link for afternoon session - http://www.stopstream.tv/43/42/434263.html

[Tripitaka of AA]

And any UK fans who haven't already found it... here is the page that shows the schedule and will have links for the feeds. It is now showing that the earlier session is available on Catch-Up.

[coralreefer]

Not sure whats up with my PC AA, but every time I have tried to use the BBC site (while attempting to do so from a UK based Proxy) I keep getting messages to turn my Javascripts on..something that is already on and have never turned off manually.

Any idea why this might be? Perhaps a proxy issue?

[Eliz]

I received a virus alert

When I checked my security though all was in working order with no threats of record.

I have not heard anything about the media where you are but I have heard that a lot of the BBC sites, etc are blocked for us. The rumor mill has it that this was done to promote On Demand sales. I also cannot access anything on YouTube as YT is also promoting On Demand viewsing.

[coralreefer]

Stream for todays matches

http://www.stopstream.tv/43/48/434885.html

For those who may not know..S. Lopez lost his opening match, ut MAY still have a chance later in the afternoon for a bronze medal match IF the fighter who beat him (cant recall the name, but from Azerbaijan) makes it to finals.

Paige McPherson won her opening match, and will fight in the next round.

Unlike other days where the competition was taking a 2-3 hour break between prelims, and quarterfinals, it appears that today they are going straight through to the final matches without a break...and should be rolling on until 7pm EST/

[coralreefer]

Thoughts on the competition~~~

First, I have to give a HUGE thumbs up to stopstream.tv! This site was exactly what I was looking for..a saving grace for those who wanted to see ALL of a particular sport or event without the network mess of commercials, hype, switching between sports when only a country that was representative of the nation of the broadcaster..etc. I literally spent the 4 days watching Taekwondo nonstop without interruption form 5pm Korea time to 5am...with the only breaks in coverage coming from the event itself when the competition went on break. I spent the entire week watching nothing but Judo and Taekwondo, and literally saw EVERYTHING from the competition so long as I could stay awake for it~


Overall, it wasnt as bad as I expected. The competition started out pretty much like I expected in the OP post to this thread. That included a good portion if not most matches consisting of fighters hopping around with a leg chambered...coming in and trying for a head shot...repetitive 4-5 kicks like we tend to see nimble demonstration folks do..etc. Honestly I was rather bummed after the first day. I don't mean to sound sexist, but I was most disappointed with the women's competition on that day, as they made up the vast majority of the "one legged dance" fighters...or otherwise those essentially flicking their feet around with little to no determination behind the kick other than hoping it would somehow touch the headgear.

Fortunately though, my observation was that as the competition went on, the "one legged dance" strategy seemed to drop off as the weighs of the fighters increased, and by the last day the competition was much better in regards to keeping with the style familiar in the Olympics.

A few notes:

- First and foremost, I truly hate this "slightest touch to the headgear wins points" I saw more than a few cases where points were given for a part of the foot touching the headgear even though the kicking motion has been well completed. For example, someone comes in with an inside crescent/inward axe kick..and the kick was blocked or otherwise tied up in the arms/shoulders of the opponent...but as the fighters were hoping around with one foot on the shoulder, the foot may have turned slightly so that a toe touches the headgear (again, the kick had been completed) and under review the points were given.

Even though I dont really like it, I could get behind giving points for slight contact IF the contact came in part of the kicking motion and just grazed the headgear...but when points are given for kicks that had been blocked or otherwise had their "energy" taken from them and the "touch" is obviously a product of the match and not the kick itself, i feel that is going a bit too far.

- The review system worked fairly well. I am especially happy with the rule concerning if a coach calls for a review but the subject of the review is rejected, that coach cannot call for another review. This was not the case when I went to the World Championships last year

- Although I dont think it is a serious issue, since they have instated these rules where slightest touch scores three points..there needs to be some stronger action concerning fighters who are head on points but literally turn their back and run in the final seconds. Its common to evade/play defense in the closing minutes, but when there are 5 seconds left and the match is so close where a fighter who is behind could possibly "slightly touch" the headgear and win, a fighters who blatantly runs from action should get more than a simple warning. This kind of evasion potentially changes the result of the match (again, given the new rule)

- I also think there needs to be points awarded for knockdowns. This used to be the case, but no more. On more than a fw occasions a fighter knocked their opponent down with a side kick or stomping kick...and when i saw knocked down, i mean flat on their behind and the perfect use of the technique. Although it may not have registered on the electronic protector...in a martial sense rejecting an opponent coming in with with a kick that knocks them down puts that player in a much more superior position in regards to real life combat...but to not award points for it seems like a tragedy.

- I was very happy to see that even in the prelims...there was only one mat devoted to competition. It was the same in Beijing as I recall although at that time there was literally no chance to see prelims unless again there was a US fighter on the mat, and even then likely wouldn't be shown.

- The fan support/turnout for the competitions was awesome! The stands seemed to be full to capacity (unlike many other events) and they were into the matches and making noise. That was awesome to see.

- I was pretty vocal about this one one of the facebook posts by US Taekwondo concerning the Lopez family, which came out after both Lopez were eliminated that they had been injured PRIOR to the competition..Diana especially with ligament damage that went untreated (how an Olympian can tear ligaments in her knee, not get treatment, and remain on the team remains a mystery although considering who the coach is comes as no surprise). I find the statement by Jean Lopez saying that the did not reveal the injuries to Diana and Steven as not wanting to tip off the competition is troubling and borderline illegal. Hiding such a fact from the Olympic committee, allowing them to compete despite their injuries, and otherwise not allowing an alternate to compete who was not injured should be investigated, and his duties as an Olympic coach should be revoked immediately..not only for failure to consider the safety of our team members (despite the family ties) but more for the fact that keeping this secret facilitated not "most fit" athletes not being on the mat representing our country. Considering both Diana and Steven lost in their opening matches anyway, the argument that "they were the most capable and skilled of those available" falls on deaf ears.

- On a much more positive note, a super-awesome story of Anthony Obame, who took the silver in the +80kg class (and came within a hair of taking the gold) giving his country of Gabon its first ever Olympic medal. In my mind that was the highlight of the Taekwondo events this year, and I shed a tear as he and his coach fell to the floor in embrace after he won his semifinal match...a moment i wont soon forget

- Congratulations to Terrence Jennings and Paige McPherson. Although ALL US fighters seemed to come out with a VERY conservative play..both of them opened up their potential in the repechage rounds and fought with spirit and fire. I would have LOVED to see them come out in their opening matches like that.

- One final note, the fighter from Mali, Modibo Kieta is a BEAST! The guy is 6'8''...230 pounds, and WAY faster than anyone I could have expected for that size. He literally towered over everyone he fought like a monster...and in his final match before he lost and injured himself, I kept thinking to myself if he would just go in kicking with power, although he may not get a point right away he could literally break the arms of his opponent, or at the very least make the guy hurt so much he would give up. Didn't realize till afterward he is a 2-time world champ...but watch out for that guy...he is awesome, and I was hoping he would win and the final match would be an All African contest!

To sum...I was pleased with the competition, not so much with certain rule changes, and cant say strongly enough how disappointed I am with Jean Lopez and that "dirty little secret" of injury to his siblings. On that issue, there needs to be a quick, thorough, and decisive investigation and remedy.

[Tripitaka of AA]

Thanks Robert, that was a fascinating post and it was much appreciated.

I watched a few bouts but was not able to give it the attention it deserved. I was probably doing a few other things at the same time. So I probably missed out on a lot of what you saw, but I found it more enjoyable than I had expected. I agree with you that the crowd played their part very well.

[Eliz]

Thanks for the recap as I missed most, if not all of the TKD competitions. I followed it on my news feed for the most part and saw small clips here and there.

It seems to me that in an effort to make the sport less subjective, they are in fact making it more subjective. They should go back to the beginning of the sport. I have long since forgetten the exact wording but the definition of a point could be surmised as "having a visual effect on the opponent." The kick or punch was with enough force that a physical reaction could be viewed/seen/observed.

I have not followed the Lopez drama so I cannot really comment. They were sort of America's First Family of TKD but I think all of us have witnessed "The Great Ones" fading into the history books (or the land of the forgotten). Even the likes of Bela and Marta Karolyi will someday come to pass. A coach covering for a favorite athlete?! Say it isn't so!!!

[giles]

Naive question, but I've been unable to find an answer. Googling for the rules of Olympic Taekwondo it seems that punches to the body are valid and score one point. Watching the matches in London I don't think I ever saw a point scored, though a few punches were thrown. The low hands stances seem to back this up.

So what are the rules and realities about punching?

[Eliz]

So what are the rules and realities about punching?

I have not been active for a few years but at that time punches [to the body] were technically worth one point. That being said, punches rarely scored.

[andyjeffries]

Naive question, but I've been unable to find an answer. Googling for the rules of Olympic Taekwondo it seems that punches to the body are valid and score one point. Watching the matches in London I don't think I ever saw a point scored, though a few punches were thrown. The low hands stances seem to back this up.

So what are the rules and realities about punching?

The rules and realities are the same as they always have been - yes, you can score with a punch (and people did at the London 2012 Olympic Games, next time I'm watching the recorded coverage if I see one, I'll snip it and post it) but it has to be a really hard/solid punch.

[coralreefer]

From my observations punches tend to be used more as either a defensive technique (to stop the forward movement or otherwise create distance for a following kick) much more than attacking. Noone goes in with a punch.

I saw it score a few times in London. While it was never really popular, with the electronic scoring system in place more are using it, and occasionally some score.