Who is Hastumi, Ashida Kim, Steven K. Hayes, Andrew Adams, Robert Bussey

**sean_stonehart** · 11-19-2003, 17:13

Originally posted by Tenshin
How about you point out some of these mistakes? And please, try to be polite. I was raised with the impression that Martial Arts promoted manners and respect.

How about signing your name on the bottom of the posts like the rules of the board (which you agreed to) specify. You can take care of it by clicking on the User CP button at the top of each page?

I know you've been reminded of this more than once....

**Don Roley** · 11-20-2003, 21:41

I might start pointing out mistakes once I know whom I am addressing. I have found that some people will only learn enough to make themselves sound good, and when these mistakes are corrected for them they show up on another board with the same behavior.

So, Tenshin, Top Dragon, Shadow Hunter or whatever your calling yourself these days, sign your real name like the rules say you have to.

**Tenshin** · 11-21-2003, 08:01

Sorry. I realised I forgot to once I made my last post, and then made a signature. Whoever Top Dragon or Shadow Hunter is, do not beleive that I'm that person using another alias. I hate people who go from board to board, spamming, and making up a million different names (such as.. say.. Eddie Weldon of neo-ninja fame..). Therefore, it would be quite hypocritical of me to become the thing I hate.

But please, correct my mistakes. I am not aware of them, as you can tell, but I do not wish to spread false information while beleiving that I am right. I am certainly not one of those people whom go around thinking they know somthing, so they can feel good about themselves, and / or raise their ego. We are forever growing, and must never stop learning, so I will await your reply so I may correct any mistakes. Thank you.

**Kreth** · 11-21-2003, 08:10

**johenora** · 11-21-2003, 13:39

Dear Tenshin:
Is your legal name really Tenshin Tsujimoto or is it a pename?
I know you are a truthful person. But would you be so kind let me know how you got first name and what it means?
Do you practice Ninpo?
So you must know the names queried in this thread.
Your Japanese name really is unique.
Cheers,

**Onmitsu** · 11-21-2003, 16:59

Andrew,
The Ninja of old have been the subject of countless movies and romantic novels. To understand the Ninja is to understand the history of fuedal Japan. It has much in common with Fuedal Europe. Wealthy and powerful war lords plunged the country into bloody civil war for centuries. The Ninja traditions developed out of this chaos. Many of the skills that a ninja had to develop are pretty useless outside of either the law enforcement or military community. One of the lasting legacies of the Ninja is their spiritual development and strong character. Believe it or not honesty is one of the more important traits to develop. Modern day students of ninjutsu seek to keep alive the traditions of the Japanese warrior and are not so concerned with scaling walls and breaking and entering to steal secret battle plans. Just by practicing the physical techniques of these arts something interesting happens. It changes who you are on the inside. I'm sure that you are familiar with the tenents of Tae Kwon Do? They've actually been around longer than the sport has. Winning a FIGHT is pretty useless when the loser comes back around to shoot you in the head. Having a strong mind and spirit helps you to avoid the conflict in the first place. In modern day society defending your self from attack does not garantee that you won't also spend a night in jail or go before a judge. There's no one to hand out plastic trophies in the hospital when your attacker and his friends returns to get his revenge.
To answer your question:
Are there real Ninja's today?
They're most likely found in today's elite military units.
There are many who seek to keep alive the Ninja spirit.
The armed and unarmed fighting methods of the ninja are still very effective menas of self defense and contain the origins of many more "sport" related martial arts. Thinking that you can master these arts overnight make for sure disapointment. It takes half a life time to get to the point where you can defend your self effectively.
Something to consider: The ideas that you expose your self to most often affect the way you think;
The way you think affects the way you act;
The way you act (your actions) affect your entire destiny.
So ask your self, is what you are studying helping to shape you into a peaceful, productive, and enlightened human being?
To me this is the most important part about being a "ninja".
I'll leave the climbing trees in pajamas to the military experts.

**Don Roley** · 11-21-2003, 19:02

Originally posted by Kreth

You called it Jeff.

One piece of advice I can give "Tenshin Tsujimoto" is this- when you want to lie about having a Japanese name you might want to choose a name that is still in common use instead of one that my wife says sounds like a Chinese take- out dish.

And if you are Japanese as you want us to believe, then what does the term "come to a head" mean in a Japanese context.

**johenora** · 11-21-2003, 22:01

Originally posted by Onmitsu to ANDREW

...The Ninja of old have been the subject of countless movies and romantic novels. To understand the Ninja is to understand the history of fuedal Japan.

To answer your question:
Are there real Ninja's today?
They're most likely found in today's elite military units......

[/B]

--------------------
Your question: "Are there real Ninja today"? is a good one.
Some whould say of course there are --look at so and so--he is doing Ninpo/Ninjitsu.
One might also ask:"Are there real Samurai today?' After the Shogunate Congress was abolished --Samurai were stripped of all status. My Japanese teacher's predecessor Sokaku Takeda no Minamoto Masa Yoshi was one of the last in that century.No more top knots,carrying swords ets. No more rights and duties for being a Samurai,let alone being a Ronin.Why admit to being a Samurai? Is there not a forthcoming movie in December with Tom Cruise--"The Last American Samurai"? But so and so is doing Samurai Arts.
One might also ask :"Is there an elusive society known as the Cosa Nostra?" And is he a member of the Black Hand? Sounds rediculous .
--------------
So my point is and I know I will be criticized--but in my humble opinion it would not be in their best interest to answer in the affirmative any one of these three interrogatories for obvious and special reasons.
Why would some one admit to these?
This proverbial problem is like a plague.
Where have they all gone? I don't know.Vanished from the face of the Earth. Still there are a lot of wanna bes.
Cheers,

**Tenshin** · 11-22-2003, 14:58

You guys are kind of weird. I think I am being viewed as people like "Yo Sato" and "Yanshido". Can't really blame you I guess. Ja matane.

"The Path of Divine Will"

**Dale Seago** · 11-22-2003, 23:57

Originally posted by Tenshin
You guys are kind of weird. I think I am being viewed as people like "Yo Sato" and "Yanshido".

Essentially, yes.

So you want us to believe that your name is in fact Tenshin Tsujimoto?

I don't think we're the ones who are weird. . .

**johenora** · 11-23-2003, 06:43

Dear TenShin Tsujimotosan:
Answer please in a relevant manner this thread pursuant to the rules or go and play your Ninja Mythology on another Board.
Are you one of the persons addressed to in the question of this thread?
Me certainly thinks not. If you are please admit it.
In all due respect your behavior ,in part,seems to be near passive -aggressive.
It is humbly suggested that you please be very careful who you point your finger at as being "kind of weird" because there are three fingers pointing back at you.
In all due respect, do you know the question of this thread?
Looks like from your trolling we had to ask you: Do we know you?
Mr. Don Roley and Mr. Dale Seago pegged you from the start.
Now further questions for you are :
"What are you?"
"Where did you come from?"
And ultimately-- "Where are you going?"
CAVEAT:You have in my opinion based on a reasonable certainty been given a lot of leeway by the powes to be.
I fear that "UeRyu" ,"TenShin" or "KageRyoshi"is going to be netted from above.
Kindly, sign your true name to your post in accordance with the rules.
If you per chance get reported and there is a strong liklihood you will, you may be banished or is it vanished by the Benificent & Benevolent Dictator.
Then what?
Cheers,

**Jay Bell** · 11-24-2003, 14:10

Tenshin,

Per forum rules, you will either post with your real full name or not post at all. This is your last warning.

**lightninrod** · 12-10-2003, 22:05

Hardcore Fighter,

I see that you want quick answers. But quick answers can mislead you. You can never tell whether an answer is fact or opinion without researching it's validity for yourself. Here are the words of Gautama Buddah from which I got my signature quotation. I think it is good advice.

Do not believe in anything just because you have heard it.
Do not believe in traditions just because they have been handed down for many generations.
Do not believe in anything because it is spoken and rumored by many.
Do not believe in anything simply because it is written in your religious books.
Do not believe in anything merely on the authority of your teachers and elders.
But....
After observation and analysis, when you find anything that agrees with reason and is conductive to the good and benefit of one and all, then accept it and live up to it.

Now, the truth, as I know it is as follows:
Ashida Kim is an American who used to claim he was a kung-fu master, but suddenly became a ninja master after the ninja craze started. His books are almost comical, especially after one has seen the real thing. Robert Bussey has trained in ninjutsu, but is not a liscensed teacher. He is another one of those "christian" martial artists, and left Bujinkan due to his religious beliefs. Andrew Adams wrote a couple of poorly researched books about ninjutsu, but has no experience in the art himself. Sho Kosugi is only an actor. And the Black Dragon Fighting Society should do some research into the symbolism of a black dragon in the esoteric arts. A dragon is the symbol of yang spiritual energy and black in the esoteric sense symbolizes death. So they, in effect, and appropriately, have named themselves "The Spiritually Dead Society".
Only one person who currently claims to be a ninjutsu grandmaster actually has the lineage scrolls to prove it, and that would be Masaaki Hatsumi. Stephen Hayes is still one of his personal students and has been for more than twenty years. He has simply done as Hatsumi requests of all his students, and has personalized his ninjutsu. Some of the mentally rigid bujinkan practitioners are not happy about this and started the rumor that he is no longer legit.
So, that's the truth and the whole truth as I have objectically observed it through the last fifteen years of my martial art obsessed life. The above information comes from many sources, and I invite you to prove it to yourself.

Sincerely,
Justin Mears

**Kreth** · 12-11-2003, 08:04

Originally posted by lightninrod
Stephen Hayes is still one of his personal students and has been for more than twenty years. He has simply done as Hatsumi requests of all his students, and has personalized his ninjutsu. Some of the mentally rigid bujinkan practitioners are not happy about this and started the rumor that he is no longer legit.

I don't think anyone has said Hayes isn't legit. More that he rarely trains with Hatsumi sensei. His trips to Japan consist mostly of photo ops. I've heard this from several Bujinkan members living in Japan. If that's what you call rigid, well...

Jeff

**johenora** · 12-11-2003, 16:47

Jeff:
I am impressed by the word "Photops",i.e.,photo opns.
You have coined a new word which I am adding to my vocabulary.
I am not being facetious. We should send it in to Websters dictionary. Well done. Now photoperations should be in every high visibility martial artists' equipment bags.
You have made my day for me.Thank you kindly.
Cheers,

**heretic888** · 12-11-2003, 19:36

More that he rarely trains with Hatsumi sensei. His trips to Japan consist mostly of photo ops. I've heard this from several Bujinkan members living in Japan. If that's what you call rigid, well...

I wouldn't call it rigid, I'd call it hearsay.

**johenora** · 12-12-2003, 04:57

Trent,et.al.---
Who is "who" was not designed for a slander board .It was designed to be constructive and aquire information for those who have a legitimate "need to know".Agreed?
In reference to RIGID--Is it hearsay or multiple hearsay?
What in the heck is the truth?
Spell it out please, if you know.
I like to hear the various opinions of these great martial artists and Ninjas who are doing so great and why?
It is getting to be a hearsay problem and I agree with you in toto.
Some rabble rousers know everything about somebody else and it sometimes becomes pure unadulterated malarky.
Let them get on BudoSeek and tell it as it is.
We are always in search of the truth as Martial artists.
On balance I could care less now who these FIVE NINJA GUYS are?
But some persons want to know in case they wish to train in that esoteric Ninja/Ninpo art.
I have problems tying to figure what is going on in a pure way.
Some are pointing their finger through their students and cronies to discredit what looks like the "competing group or persons in the group".
Is the martial arts in the USA just another big business operation with photopns and internet and martial art magazines etc.to make big money out of the back yard? No it is not. It is for the betterment of the individuals in it and our society in a good and wholesome way.
It is not one big Happy American Family like it used to be. Is there no more unity and respect for the arts itself for the sake of the art?
Backstabbing,name calling, crys of this and that--this is a small example of what is on the horizon.
Mostly everyone of the BudoSeek contributors are helping in positive ways---as to their students, work places,working together and sharing on BudoSeek.
Not like some of the slander boards I see out there passing out so much miss-information to inflate their egos.On these other boards you will see:
Such swollen bravado as not found in the arena of sweat and tears. Let us please be better than ourselves.
------
I can guarantee you this.In the USA martial arts is and are the best. If it wasn't why would all these foreigners be here trying to grab at the American spirit?
If Americans want to go to foreign lands and learn foreign martial arts of their own free will and accord-- fine. We are a land of freedom and liberty. In some Nations you can not even study knife attacks ,nor how to defend against a gun-etc
I prefer martial arts on the good old USA soil --in Texas,NY,NJ California , Alaska etc(50 Great States)even if it is Ninjitsu,Judo,Brazilian JuJitsu ,Boxing,Kung Fu,Tai Chi.Muay Thai etc. The taste of USA martial arts is the best until it is proven to me otherwise..
Happy Holidays.

**heretic888** · 12-12-2003, 06:27

Oh. My. God.

I don't even know where to begin....

**Don Roley** · 12-12-2003, 06:28

Originally posted by johenora
Trent,et.al.---
Who is "who" was not designed for a slander board .It was designed to be constructive and aquire information for those who have a legitimate "need to know".Agreed?

Excuse me, did you ask the original question? Are you a moderator? If not, then who are you to tell people how to respond?

Some people like straight answers. I am trying to get some straight ones right now on who to trust and who to avoid in Chinese internal arts. As such, it is of value for people to speak frankly about who they consider frauds and who they consider worthy of listening to. Ashida Kim is a laughing stock. I speak fluent Japanese and can tell you that "Kim" is not a Japanese name and the terms, history, technique, etc he uses has no resemblence to anything I have seen while living in Japan. If someone saves some time and money by avoinding his stuff after reading what I wrote, then I have served some small use.

I will say this very loudly about anyone I consider a fraud. if you do not like it, tough! I can not sit by in good consicience and let others be misled by frauds because I worry about my image. I will speak up even if peopl ethink I am negative. If you don't like it, then go back to the Ashida Kim message boards.

If I had asked a question and you had barged in telling people to only speak nice about the people I ask about, I would be rather mad. As long as everyone speaks the truth, then speaking negativly about dishonarable people serves a purpose.

Honestly, I find people like you who ask others not to speak up about frauds to generally be the ones to have the most to hide. If Hardcore fighter does not want to hear negative responses to his quetion, or Jay Bell tells us as a moderator what we can say or not, then I will isten to them. But who are you to dictate what we can and can not say?