Iran and Hapkido

**modern hapkido** · 04-06-2005, 09:24

I just returned from almost two weeks in Iran setting up and training with the Iran Modern Hapkido Association. As far as I know I was the first high ranking American martial artist to visit Iran since their revolution in 1979.

It is a strange feeling to see your photo in martial arts magazines with text that you cannot read in Farsi.

I will be posting more pictures and detailed articles about that visit in the near future on www.modernhapkipo.org.

For now have included several thumbnail photos (1. Group picture, Black Belt only Seminar exception the two chilrden of my bodyguard, another story for later.... 2. Caspian Sea in background behind Deputy Chief Master Reza Valinejad, President of iran Modern Hapkido Federation, myself, and Dr. Keyvan Dehnad, Senior Advisor on International Growth and Development....3. Demonstration of a type of head control....and 4. Stopping for tea in the mountains, a cultural must in Iran)

**Hapkiyoosool** · 04-07-2005, 08:15

I have a personal problem teaching in the middle east after 9/11. Maybe I am skiddish but, I think teaching anyone over there could cause you big problems later. It could come back to bite you in the Butt.

Our Grandmaster in Korea strictly told us NOT to teach anyone from in that area.

Thoughts?..........

**BBFC** · 04-07-2005, 09:01

I second that; I wouldn't go to that country to teach anything especially martial arts. Its a no brainier that country is not friendly with us why go were the weather is sticky, damp and hot in politics?

It will come back to haunt you………….big brother is always watching.

**iron_ox** · 04-07-2005, 10:09

Victor,

Well done. Nice to see someone move beyond simple assinine blanket prejudice and train folks obviously hungry to learn. Good Job.

I never heard of anyone running to the middle of a crowded room and "blowing up with some Hapkido".

One of my long tome instructors was the first to teach in the Soviet Union - in the Kremlin and to the KGB - during the cold war no less - I guess a little Hapkido hardly held together the "Red Menace".

To the more bigoted here, will you refuse to teach Arab Americans? Are all Arabs "Bad"? You will probably say, "no, and I have some Arab Friends" right? Will you teach Black Muslims, members from the Nation of Islam?

"Our Grandmaster in Korea strictly told us NOT to teach anyone from in that area."

Only living there, from "there", national orign from "there". Rooster, you have no real clue about the world do you? Most countries in the world have created a level of hatred for the US because of the military, government or other organizational policy that only shows that the US is a "strong arm group". Individuals always have a better chance of showing the US in a good light. But, small minded bigots ALWAYS show themselves eventually.

Again, good job Victor for teaching some people that really want to learn - you obviously send positive vibes about Americans. That is what will make the US not seem like just a government policy.

I second that; I wouldn't go to that country to teach anything especially martial arts. Its a no brainier that country is not friendly with us why go were the weather is sticky, damp and hot in politics?

Ummm, have you EVER been invited to teach outside the US? The country is not friendly or the government is not friendly? How unfriendly are they when they invited him over, and made him welcome? Weather is sticky, damp and hot in politics? What does that mean - sorry, but bigots sound silly with proper English - but that statement has me rolling. Sticky damp and hot in politics sounds like any New York Summer or New Your City Hall meeting to me...grow up.

**Knicky** · 04-07-2005, 10:42

I think a good Hapkido instructor teaches a person more than how to hurt someone. They teach them the mind set that goes with the responsibility of knowing Hapkido.

I think if terrorist's had that mind set - they wouldn't be terrorists.

There will always be good people, no matter where you go in the world. I think its important to realize that.

**ushankido** · 04-07-2005, 11:18

As the moderator it is my responsibility to intervene when discussions get very heated. Just so you know, I am half-Korean and half-Arab -- my father is from Bahrain. According to Mr. Allen’s grandmaster I shouldn’t be learning martial arts apparently because I might pose a security risk. The statement smacks of prejudice and such statements will not be tolerated on Budo Seek. I train at the IHF’s headquarters in Yong-In all the time and I’ve always been made welcome.

The World Taekwondo Federation (WTF), Kuk Sool Won, Sin Moo Hapkido, and many other martial art organizations have schools in Iran. I don’t think they would do so if they thought they were training terrorists.

Another point that has been brought up is that visiting Iran and training Iranians helps to build personal relationships that could help build trust between our nations. I couldn’t agree more. This is besides the fact that despite the hostile political climate between the US and Iran, many cultural and intellectual exchanges continue. The American and Iranian national soccer teams have played together. Our government sent rescue teams and dogs to help after the earthquake in the Iranian city of Bam.

We made similar overtures with the Soviet Union even during the height of the Cold War. My friend remembers going to a cultural exhibition that showcased aspects of Soviet culture in Los Angeles back in the 1970s. Also, remember the young girl from Maine, Samantha Smith, who was invited to the USSR after writing to Soviet Premier Andropov asking him to help solve US-Soviet tensions in 1983? I also know several students who studied in the USSR on student exchanges. Should all of this not been allowed?

I think a lot of good came from these visits. My hat’s off to the man who went to Iran.

**Jeff C.** · 04-07-2005, 11:25

As Victor knows from experience, the Iranian people are not hostile towards the US. The Iranian government is. Big difference.

Victor, in one of your pictures that cane looks like something Shuey made - I've got one just like it.

Good job on your trip, sir!

Jeff Cook
Wabujitsu

**jabonn** · 04-07-2005, 11:29

Victor I applaude your efforts to teach those that are willing to learn. My caution is Iran is an OFAC country and has been on that list through many admistrations. Travel is not prohibited, but business and certain relations are prohibited.

Take for example Bobby Fisher played a game of chess (for money/for monetary gain) in Yugoslavia, an OFAC country. Bobby was cited by the United States for conducting business with an OFAC nation. I keep the Bobby story short but you can read about it URL=http://www.freebobbyfischer.net/modules/news/]here[/URL]

I am sure you completed your research prior to your visit to Iran. The information that follows is for other members to review.

http://www.treas.gov/offices/enforce...ns/t11iran.pdf - A list of transactions/exchanges/travel policy that is allow or prohibited.

Office of Foreign Assets Control

Mission
The Office of Foreign Assets Control ("OFAC") of the US Department of the Treasury administers and enforces economic and trade sanctions based on US foreign policy and national security goals against targeted foreign countries, terrorists, international narcotics traffickers, and those engaged in activities related to the proliferation of weapons of mass destruction. OFAC acts under Presidential wartime and national emergency powers, as well as authority granted by specific legislation, to impose controls on transactions and freeze foreign assets under US jurisdiction. Many of the sanctions are based on United Nations and other international mandates, are multilateral in scope, and involve close cooperation with allied governments.

**howard** · 04-07-2005, 11:46

Originally Posted by Jeff C.

As Victor knows from experience, the Iranian people are not hostile towards the US. The Iranian government is. Big difference....

Jeff Cook
Wabujitsu

Similarly, most Americans are probably not hostile toward Iran just because our current administration is. Remember that 49% of the country voted against the current administration.

There will always be people in all countries of the world who will support their government line without question (this is not to say that any such people are taking part in this discussion). But there will also always be people who will disagree with the government line when it clashes with their personal views, and will follow their personal beliefs rather than the government's views. Of course, this is easier to do in, say, the US than it is in, say, North Korea.

btw, I didn't see anything inherently prejudiced in Rooster's post. Seems to me that his point is that, in the post-9/11 environment, any American who goes to a country with which the current administration is at odds could be asking for trouble in the form of governmental investigations. I agree with that point, irrespective of my views about teaching hapkido to Iranians, Arabs from any country or any other group of law-abiding individuals, no matter where they're from (which I have no quarrel with).

**moksha** · 04-07-2005, 12:15

Mr. Sogor,

Why? everytime you make a post, you always have to heat the situation up. And assume things. No where in Master Allen's post did he come off as being prejudice. When I was in Florida we had students from every race, gender color etc. And Master Allen taught everyone equally. Again, you always write stuff like this. Just stop.

**jabonn** · 04-07-2005, 12:25

Knicky please update your profile with your first and last name. Thanks.

- Sorry for the side bar.

**ELBOHEMIO** · 04-07-2005, 18:37

You guys like to fight each other...

You start to look like my parents. (lol)

Spend more time in the mat and not in the "Bochinches".

BE WATER!!!

**iron_ox** · 04-07-2005, 19:25

Originally Posted by Rooster

.

Our Grandmaster in Korea strictly told us NOT to teach anyone from in that area.

This is a prejudicial statement - period - it defines all people under a single geographic area as unacceptable. This is wrong. Does that satisfy you Merchant?

**kodanjaclay** · 04-07-2005, 20:38

Ok, here is the bottom line:

as one of my esteemed colleagues indicated, racism shall not be tolerated on Budoseek!

That being said, I can see the argument for security concerns where arabs are concerned. I really can. They are all out to get us and hate America... or are they and do they? Is it the arab people, or is it a small minority of people? Secondly, Iranians are not arab, they are occidental.

My personal feeling where arabs, Iranians and the like are concerned is quite simple. We are people. If we treat each other like people and give respect to one another, we would see alot less bull stuff in the world. If we are cut we all bleed red. Period. Let politicians be politicians and let us as martial artists teach through example. Just make sure you follow the law and do the best you can in life and that will bring you respect no matter what race or creed you are.

On the other hand, Master Allan has a right to his personal feeling and I will admit for a long time I was very anti-arab. I lost some good friends in 9-11. But even the exact plans were kept from all the terrorists. Why? Because once again, a minority wanted to affect the majority simply because THEY were upset.

**Michael Tomlinson** · 04-07-2005, 21:05

Iranians are not Arabs...they are Persians...I'm not getting into this fray...I have my own beliefs and they are mine and no one elses but have fun guys....
Michael Tomlinson

**kodanjaclay** · 04-07-2005, 22:23

Actually if we really do want to be technical:

there are Jews, Kurds, Turks, Arabs, Occidentals and just about every other ethnicity in Iran. I worked on a project where my PM was an Iranian Jew. Interestingly, and someone else may be able to comment clearer, it seems that all the Iranians I met seemed to mumble which hurt my comprehension of what they were saying. Anyone else have this experience?

Anyhow, my point was solely that you can't blame an entire culture for a few miscreants.

**iron_ox** · 04-07-2005, 22:40

Originally Posted by kodanjaclay

Anyhow, my point was solely that you can't blame an entire culture for a few miscreants.

Well said.

**American HKD** · 04-08-2005, 08:00

Greetings

I agree and I'm jewish.

I don't believe all "the arabs are bad".

The terrorists if you will are mainly some kind of twisted religous freaks who are bent on destruction of ANY culture outside of thier own believes.

They put down women rights, personal freedoms, open societies, education, to rule as dictators.

Polpot killed ober 1,000,000 in Cambodia for the same reasons.
You also have Uganda, The Sudan, Serbia was like that, the list continues.

One of the problem we do have, is there are terrorists in the US operating and posing as friends or neighbors or business owners and you don't know who they might be.

I don't think teaching a undercover terroist MA (which is a 1,000,000 to one shot) is going to make them any more problematic than they already are for the free world.

**DragonMind** · 04-08-2005, 09:14

First off, well done, Master Cushing. It takes courage and compassion to take what was surely going to be an unpopular course of action to some. Isolation and ignorance are the best breeding grounds for prejudice. You have taken a big step in combating both.

Secondly, Iran has a very rich and diverse culture, including indigenous martial arts that actually do date back thousands of years, unlike certain others that like to cast stones. If you'd like to learn a little more try these:

Kirkpinar
Pahlavani

**moksha** · 04-08-2005, 09:28

reply,

Mr. Sogor,

(Master Allen) I have a personal problem teaching in the middle east after 9/11.

this is what Master Allen said. Anyone with intelligence can see that all he is saying is that after 9/11 he does not feel it's right to go THERE and teach.

(Master Allen)I think teaching anyone over there could cause you big problems later. It could come back to bite you in the Butt.

Again, no where is he saying anything prejudice, or saying not to teach a certain minority. He is refer ing to not going over to a foreign country, one which has openly denied certain issuse with our goverment.

Mr.Sogor, time and time again you find someway of twisting reality. You do it on every forum your a member of. And to think that some people in your own organization don't want anything to do with what you say.